low spin drivers - want to experiment a little

[chemboy2]

A while back I pulled the NV out of my SQ Tour in favor of a VS Proto. I don't have any launch monitor numbers but the VS Proto does launch a little higher. Everything had been all fine and dandy and I really liked how the VS performed. That was, until, I played my first round in some real WIND. My tee shots were ballooning horribly. I'd feel like I killed one only to look up and see it climb to an unsettling height and the drop straight down (or so it seemed). Needless to say, I'm disappointed.

Now, the point of the thread. First off, the NV is going back into SQ Tour head and that will become my benchmark. This will leave me with a VS Proto, ~100 bucks, and the desire to experiment. I'm looking for a lower spin head to throw on the VS Proto and see if I can't best the NV shafted SQ Tour. I'd love to give the Geek DCT a try but I'm leaning towards known OEMs here as I'd like to not lose my shirt if I decide to pull the plug, you know?

Anyway, I'm looking seriously at picking up a Cleveland HiBore, Cally FT-3, or Bridgestone J33 as my understanding is that all three are lower spin heads. Any other ideas? Is the HiBore XL less spin than the original? Does anyone have experience with at least two of these that can give some comparisons?

Worst case scenario, the SQ Tour with NV stays put and you see one of the above heads and a VS Proto in the classifieds...

[Rockford35]

The XL and the FT-3 are very long and hot off the face. The J33 is decent, but outclassed by the other two, IMO.

If you went Geek, you wouldn't have a tough time selling the head if it wasn't for you. Grab a 10.5 and throw that shaft into it and bomb away.

R35

[chemboy2]

Originally Posted by Rockford35

The XL and the FT-3 are very long and hot off the face. The J33 is decent, but outclassed by the other two, IMO.

If you went Geek, you wouldn't have a tough time selling the head if it wasn't for you. Grab a 10.5 and throw that shaft into it and bomb away.

R35

I'm actually glad you chimed in as you were the first one that came to mind as I know you've had the original HiBore and play the FT-3 now. How does the non-XL HiBore compare with the FT3?

There's actually a Blueboard shafted FT3 sitting in the used bin at the local GS... very, very tempting.

[Eracer]

This question reminds me how utterly ignorant I am about club technology. All this talk about low-spin driver heads has me scratching my head. If driver A and driver B have the same face angle, are both fitted with the same shaft, hit the same ball, using an Iron Byron machine at identical settings, how can they possibly differ in the backspin they impart to the ball?

Does it have to do with the elasticity of the face, and how long the ball "sticks" to the face during impact? Is it the "roll" of the clubface? I can understand how bulge might affect sidespin, but as for backspin?

I just don't get this at all...

[footballking732]

correct me if im wrong, but isnt the Hibore High-spin?? its high launch, i know that...

i would go with the Geek DCT if you want a low-spin driver... they hold their resale value pretty well..

or depending on how much that FT-3 BlueBoard combo is, you might snag that..

[Rockford35]

Originally Posted by Eracer

This question reminds me how utterly ignorant I am about club technology. All this talk about low-spin driver heads has me scratching my head. If driver A and driver B have the same face angle, are both fitted with the same shaft, hit the same ball, using an Iron Byron machine at identical settings, how can they possibly differ in the backspin they impart to the ball?

Does it have to do with the elasticity of the face, and how long the ball "sticks" to the face during impact? Is it the "roll" of the clubface? I can understand how bulge might affect sidespin, but as for backspin?

I just don't get this at all...

My gawd, you're dense.

Most drivers have a very low CG that launches the ball higher to get maximum carry. A little more spin is the result. Carry is what many guys need, but without so OEM's have responded with such.

However, if you're already a high launch player and require more of a flat trajectory, a lower spin head will achieve a better carry while maximizing distance at the same time. Basically, guys with higher swingspeed will maximize the use of a lower spin head, for the mostpart. Obviously, this isn't a rule, but a generalality at best.

Originally Posted by footballking732

correct me if im wrong, but isnt the Hibore High-spin?? its high launch, i know that...

i would go with the Geek DCT if you want a low-spin driver... they hold their resale value pretty well..

or depending on how much that FT-3 BlueBoard combo is, you might snag that..

The original HiBore is extremely high spin, and for that reason, extremely accurate. However, it's distances are to be desired. It is an EXTREMELY difficult head to fit into a swing properly, which is why it basically failed. The new XL is back to the old way of thinking, with a bit higher CG and a little less spin. It's a rocket. And alot easier to fit into than that of the original HiBore.

The FT-3 is mid spin, as far as I'm concerned. I don't balloon it, but the 8.5* I have launches about the same as the 9.2* head I had in my DCT. Granted, some of that is "actual loft vs noted loft", but I digress.

R35

[chemboy2]

Rock - I was under the impression that the original HiBore was high launch with low spin therefore giving the boring trajectory. If it is high spin then it is most certainly NOT the direction I want to go.

Eracer - I'm not really sure I understand the "why" either. I only know that I am a high launch player that has never had a problem getting a tee shot in the air. The only driver I've tried that I couldn't get all that airborne was my buddy's 8.5* Bridgestone J33 with an 83g x-stiff Blueboard. I hit it pretty well but it doesn't get in the air much and only carries a little over 200yds.

So, those that have played the Geek DCT, I believe I've read reviews that painted it as not all that forgiving; this could be a bad thing...

[Rockford35]

Originally Posted by chemboy2

Rock - I was under the impression that the original HiBore was high launch with low spin therefore giving the boring trajectory. If it is high spin then it is most certainly NOT the direction I want to go.

You have me here, I stand corrected. Reading back, I screwed up on my post.

"The original HiBore is extremely high spin, and for that reason, extremely accurate." This should have read "High launch", not high spin. My bad there, sorry.

That being said, even with the low spin/high launch of the orginal HiBore, it is incredibly difficult to fit properly. I think short of having a bunch to hit and try different shafts in, it's pretty hard to guess what shaft would work best in that head. A few have come out lucky (myself with the Evolution, the NVS and I think YG has a Purple Ice or something like that in his), but I wouldn't count on it.

If you can find a good deal on an XL, it's a great buy. So is the FT-3, but it's norwhere near the low spin of the DCT.

R35

[Youngun5]

Purple Ice? what do you take me for?

with a 110 mph swing i'm getting around 2800 RPMs of backspin in my HiBore, with a carry distance of around 285 and rolling out to the high 290s according the the PureLaunch machine at my work. that is with a lower spinning shaft however, the Grafalloy Bimatrx Proto. with my previous shaft, the YS-6+ i was ballooning a little and losing some 15 yards or so. the machine puts out the optimum numbers for you after you've hit shots and have a good average going and my launch and spin are spot on with what it says i should be getting.

i have watched the HiBore dramatically reduce average golfer's spin rates with the crappy stock shaft in it as well by 2,000 RPMs in some cases meanwhile still giving off great launch angle numbers.

i vote HiBore. just make sure you tee it low. had a guy come in wanting to return one he had bought. he said he wasn't hitting it anywhere at all. I asked him to tee one up like he normally does (ball is all the way above the crown at address). i retee it for him about 3/4 of an inch above the ground and tell him to hit. he instantly gains 20-25 yards and walks back out of the store with same HiBore in hand.

(if you do with a geek, i'll take it off your hands once you decide it was a mistake and go for the HiBore )

good luck,

-YG

[LyleG]

The difference in spin from one head to another is quite small and really doesnt make that much of a difference. Like I said in another thread, loft is far, far more important. Loft, your angle of attack and the ball you use play a far greater role than a clubs COG.

[Eracer]

Originally Posted by Rockford35

My gawd, you're dense.

Most drivers have a very low CG that launches the ball higher to get maximum carry. A little more spin is the result. Carry is what many guys need, but without so OEM's have responded with such.

However, if you're already a high launch player and require more of a flat trajectory, a lower spin head will achieve a better carry while maximizing distance at the same time. Basically, guys with higher swingspeed will maximize the use of a lower spin head, for the mostpart. Obviously, this isn't a rule, but a generalality at best.




The original HiBore is extremely high spin, and for that reason, extremely accurate. However, it's distances are to be desired. It is an EXTREMELY difficult head to fit into a swing properly, which is why it basically failed. The new XL is back to the old way of thinking, with a bit higher CG and a little less spin. It's a rocket. And alot easier to fit into than that of the original HiBore.

The FT-3 is mid spin, as far as I'm concerned. I don't balloon it, but the 8.5* I have launches about the same as the 9.2* head I had in my DCT. Granted, some of that is "actual loft vs noted loft", but I digress.

R35

I still don't get it...

[RickinMA]

I had been reading the Wishon monthly tech report and was interested to read this section Tom Wishon Golf Technology - June 2007 TWGT eTECHreport

launch angle can be impacted 1-2* by head design, but spin rates only varied 400 rpm from the highest to the lowest

[ezra76]

My personal experiences varied greatly on launch monitors. I got 2200 out of an R510TP/757, 1750 with an XL/Fuji Red, 3500 out of Sumo/VS and nearly 5000 out of the Sumo2/Stock Diamana.

I've yet to get numbers on the BurnerTP but it's noticibly different than any head I've hit before. It carries higher and further than any driver I've ever hit in any loft. To me that translates to the highest launch and lowest spin, that I've hit anyway.

[LyleG]

EZ,

the problem is all those clubs had different shafts in them. I assume you didnt use the same ball either. I would hope the lofts were at least the same.

[chemboy2]

Originally Posted by LyleG

The difference in spin from one head to another is quite small and really doesnt make that much of a difference. Like I said in another thread, loft is far, far more important. Loft, your angle of attack and the ball you use play a far greater role than a clubs COG.

Well, the stated loft on the sole is 8.5*; I should have that checked though. I'm going to put the NV back in this week and see how that goes for a while.

For the record, I use the Bridgestone e6, Callaway HXHot, or Titleist NXT Tour. Looking my back the days I would call my "great" driving days were all with the Cally...

Originally Posted by RickinMA

I had been reading the Wishon monthly tech report and was interested to read this section Tom Wishon Golf Technology - June 2007 TWGT eTECHreport

launch angle can be impacted 1-2* by head design, but spin rates only varied 400 rpm from the highest to the lowest

Good read, thank you! All those tweaks to create models within a line and largest delta observed is 400rpm. hmmm