Hhhmmmm..... A year wasted?

[bdcrowe]

I think so.

It was pointed out to me a year ago that I had a pretty flat swing. So, I've worked for a year to go more upright. My handicap has gone up 10 points since. I've heard all of the arguments: an upright swing is on the target line longer; an upright swing isn't as dependent on timing as a flat swing. And still, my handi has gone up 10 points.

Yesterday, I saw a bit of info on the one plane, 2 plane swings. I think to myself, "That one plane swing looks a lot like my old swing. You know, the one before your handi went up by double-digits?" I started looking into it. The one-pane swing desciption I got said that it is LESS susceptible to timing than the 2 plane swing. Less? However can that be? Because, it says, the arms stay connected with the chest there is no need to time the reconnection at the beginning of the downswing. You can just fire the hips and the connected arms automatically follow.

That sounds familliar. That sounds like how I used to shoot in the 80s. Do tell...

So, I knock off a half-day yesterday and hit the range. I go back to (what is now, I guess, called) a one plane swing. Bend over more at address, farther from the ball, wider stance. Keep the left arm cozy against the chest on backswing, keep the right elbow tucked nicely on the backswing, makes for a pretty flattish swing... Drive/rotate the hips and feel my dead-fish arms square and just along for the ride. (a la Vijay, BTW.)

Wedges high, long and straight.

Irons high, long and slight draw.

Woods mid trajectory, long and slight draw.

Driver, Boring, long and slight draw.

Now, get this, and this is where things get weird. You guys ready for this Roswell Golf sh*t?

All of my shots were repeating. They all did the same thing one after the other. If my irons were drawing, they were all drawing. All of my woods did the same thing. The driver repeated swing after swing. How can this be? I can't remember the last time something like that happened in my game.

I took the new/old swing to the course for 9 holes of company league golf. I busted my quota by a BUNCH! And that was with my chipping on holiday. Driver was so great, I was on in 2 both par 5s, with 7 iron (overshot the green) and 5 iron (back of the green).

Now, here's why I think this swing works for me, whereas it may not for others. I have always been one to fire my hips to start the swing. That's the cornerstone of my timing. With a 2 plane swing, since the arms are disconnected, you have to pause the hips while the arms reconnect. 1-planing it, the arms never become disconnected, so an immediate hip rotation just pulls the arms on plane along with them and square into the ball. That's the ticket for me. Individual results may vary.

I'd love everyone's ideas on this. I saw a similar thread on GR about this and noted Bravo is a 2 planer. What goes on with everyone else?

[DaveE]

Well at least I understand your comment a few weeks, ago about not following you to the dark side, a little better.

I have a flatter swing too. Like you, I tried to go more upright but gave it up pretty fast. Also like you, I'm trying to get back to where I was last summer. I found a drill I was using then so I'm going back to that and see what happens.

I like the feel of a 1 plane swing. Everything feels connected and I think that helps a hack like me. If I could develop a swing that was reliable and repeatable I'd go with either in a heartbeat though.

FWIW, I think I've read that Els is a single planer too and I wouldn't mind having his swing.

[Silver]

and from what I heard on the Peter Jacobsen academy live last week...one plane swings are better for your back

[Farquod]

Originally Posted by bdcrowe

Individual results may vary.

That just about says it all, no? I think you've actually saved time, because now you know what feels right--and works--for you.

Why did you change, anyway? Distance doesn't seem to be an issue for you, and your accuracy appears to be OK. Just curious.

Sometimes, all you need to stop the headache is to stop hitting yourself in the head with a hammer.

[bdcrowe]

Originally Posted by Farquod

Sometimes, all you need to stop the headache is to stop hitting yourself in the head with a hammer.

Well said.

I changed because I thought I was supposed to look like everyone else at the top. I didn't stop to notice that some folks used the "classic" swing too. I also went into a stretch of inconsistency and thought a complete overhaul was the ticket.

Truth be told, I also think the past year was great. When I was on one plane swing, I didn't always clear my hips, and sometimes tried to swing with mostly arms, thus the inconsisyency. When I went to a more upright plane and studied Nicklaus more, I learned that I need to clear my hips. So now I SEEM to be marrying what I've learned with my APPARENT natural swing style and it is all clicking. Hopefully it lasts.

[VtDivot]

I'm a 2 planer and timing is everything. If it's off I hit lots of pulls and/or huge nasty hooks (not so much with the driver, but with the fairway woods and long irons)

[Quentin]

Originally Posted by bdcrowe

Bend over more at address

If you're bending over more at address, would that not make your swing more upright and not flat? I try to get right over the ball and keep my hands close to the body. I have an upright swing.

~QQ

[bdcrowe]

Technically, yes. But the fact that I am not lifting my arms higher thatn the angle that my shoulders make during the turn makes it overall flatter.

[bdcrowe]

Weird times...

I snuck out for a quick nine to prep for tomorrow's tournament and to get a grip (no pun intended) on the "new old" swing.

Jeckyl and Hyde my friends... Jeckyl and Hyde...

I had 4 pars 3 doubles and 2 bogies. 4 out of the 9 holes felt so easy with this swing that it was laughable. 3 woods off of tee into middle fairway about 250 or 260, wedge to 12 or 18 feet, 2 putts, next hole...

Then some holes, I felt like I was "mixing" the two swings and all hell broke loose. Weird pushes, occasional tops or thins... And I knew full well it was happening while I swung, cause I could feel myself doing it.

(One of the bogies actually even made me smile. Started off with a topped tee shot into the drink. Retee and hit 22* utility about 230 middle fairway for the Jeckyl/Hyde effect. Hit a choked and abbreviated lob wedge from about 50 yards. It lands 5 inches from the hole, hits the flag and rolls about 12 feet away. 1 putt; count em up for a surprise bogie...)

Anyways, the swing change feels like it should take seat rather quickly and it looks promising for the long-run.

[Loop]

So... will you be advocating me to a flatter swing ?

Call me SmartAssHat hahahahha

[bdcrowe]

Originally Posted by Loop

So... will you be advocating me to a flatter swing ?

Call me SmartAssHat hahahahha

Hey, I may be a slow learner, but I learn. Far be it for me, dude. Far be it for me...

[SiberianDVM]

Originally Posted by Silver

and from what I heard on the Peter Jacobsen academy live last week...one plane swings are better for your back

...... the first time I missed it because I hadn't taken up golf (again).

As best as I can tell, I'm a 1 planer.

Since I'm kinda vertically challenged (5' 7" on a tall day), does the 1 plane swing fit my build better than a 2 plane?

What's the best book for figuring this out?

[MassenaRedRaiders]

I think i'm a one planer also, but I'm not really sure can someone go into some detail on the difference between the two. And bdcrowe I'm glad that you are finding a swing that is working better for you.

[Pa Jayhawk]

When I took my lesson last year, the instructor pretty much said that I now have a one plane swing. Not sure when it came about from learning 5 years ago. I kind of had a lousy year going until I finally accepted that I should go with it and see. My Handicap index went up approximately 10 strokes in the last couple years. After the lesson and just trying out the one plane swing, it dropped about 4 strokes in maybe 2 months. I knew nothing about a one plane swing prior too the lesson. The main reason for the lesson was that my hands and swing were terribly uncomfortable at the top of my backswing. Mainly trying to redirect the club on plane, when it in fact never left the correct plane. Not sure what the new year will bring when I start back up again.

Here is a useful site for anyone interested.
http://www.oneplanegolfswing.com/p3_...two_plane.html

[Ravenous Bugblatter Beast]

I was thinking about this this morning, about how to tell the difference between a one-plane swing versus a two-plane swing. The first key thing to foucs on is what is meant by plane in the descriptions.

When you address the ball, imagine a flat piece of plywood sitting on your shoulders, perpindicular to your spine. That is your shoulder plane. Then look at your arms. Imagine a a piece of plywood from your shoulders to your wrists, and that will be the plane your arms will be working with.

Now, when you swing, if the planes of your shoulder plane and the plane of your arms plane remain locked at the same angle to one another, you are on one plane, and have a one-plane swing. In this type of swing, you can almost guarantee that the upper arms will stay the same distance of separation from the chest, hence that is why Vijay Singh practices with the towel in the armpit--if his arms disconnect, the towel drops and he will know he is getting away from the one-plane swing he wants.

In a two-plane swing, the arms are free to work away from the chest, and if you look at the planes formed as I described earlier, at different points of the golf swing you'll see differences in the angles of the planes to one another.

The important thing to gain from understanding the differences between one-plane and two-plane is that some tips do not work with both swings. I'm a two-planer and if I were to try to keep my arms from disconnecting from my chest like Vijay, I'd seriously mess up my swing, my timing, and would be wasting my practice.

Another way to identify if a swing is one-plane or two plane is to watch where the hands remain postioned relative to the plane formed by the shoulders. In a one-plane swing the hands at the bottom of the swing will be the same distance from the plane of the shoulders as they are when the hands are at the top of the swing. In a two-plane, the hands will likely travel from underneath the shoulder plane to above the shoulder plane when the hands reach the top of the swing.

I hope these descriptions are accurate and will help anyone who is trying to understand this topic.