what causes forward spin?

[rubber314chicken]

first tee box today, I hit the ball great. I made good contact, but as soon as it passed the edge of the fairway, it just stuck onto the ground. There was a ton of forward spin on the thing, and what could have been a 250 yard drive turned into a 75 yard shot that left me at the start of the fairway.

I don't think I topped the ball, and I saw a ball mark on the sweet spot that may or may not have been left by that shot, but what causes a ball to have so much forward spin?

[Eracer]

It is practically impossible to put topspin on a ball. You simply didn't have enough launch angle to overcome gravity.

I suppose you could make perfect contact with the leading edge of the sole of the club, hitting the ball above the equator. But I don't see how the ball would go more than a few feet if you did that.

[rubber314chicken]

It is practically impossible to put topspin on a ball. You simply didn't have enough launch angle to overcome gravity.

I suppose you could make perfect contact with the leading edge of the sole of the club, hitting the ball above the equator. But I don't see how the ball would go more than a few feet if you did that.

if you saw the drive, you would have instantly put top spin as the cause. I know for a fact it had forward spin because of how it dropped. It wasn't just a drop, it accelerated faster than gravity would accelerate the ball into the ground.

[shanemc13]

Yep, you more than likely made contact slightly above the equator of the ball. The angle of the swing will get it in the air then the spin will take it to the dirt.

[rubber314chicken]

hmm.... okay. That's stange that I managed to do that considereing I useally hit just above the sweet spot

[raven34]

Yeah you must have hit it on the up above the equator. No other way of getting topspin. Surprising though that it even got up off the ground.

[LyleG]

You will never put top spin on a ball with a full swing.

[SilverUberXeno]

I'd agree with Lyle and Eracer. The only way to do this in theory is to hit the ball above the equator, and if you did that, you'd smash it straight into the ground.

You're not used to seeing a ball drop that fast because most every shot has a slight amount, at LEAST, of backspin, which keeps it in the air longer.

What you say is a dead shot falling as it normally would, minus spin.

[FastForward7]

You will never put top spin on a ball with a full swing.

Want to bet? I was playing a month ago with a friend of mine and we were teeing off after making the turn. The hole slopes down about 100 feet or so from the tee box. So he hits his drive and it goes about 50 yards straight, and with a fairly low trajectory. Then the spin catches up to it (or whatever is the explanation) and it just bites, takes an almost 90 degree dive, and rockets toward the ground. I've never seen anything like it.

I've put forward spin on a ball now and then at the range too. Nothing like that but...

[zaphod]

Rather than forward spin--which is almost impossible I'm guessing knuckle ball. Hit some of those worn out range balls with no dimples and see what I mean. They fly with unpredictable but determined nature.

[eclark53520]

This is more a difference in perception, we see normal ball flight with alot of back spin and expect that, so if one comes off the club with little or no backspin and it is subject to gravity in its fullest without any lift from the backspin it falls out of the air and we perceive it as forward spin...there is NO WAY you are going to put enough front spin on a ball and it get in the air high enough(due to how you would have to hit the ball to get forward spin) to actually see it affect the ball in any perceivable way.

[SilverUberXeno]

Echoing my sentiments, here.

The physical property responsible for lift caused by backspin is the Bernoulli effect. Check it out.

Fastforward, it's amusing how you start with "Wanna bet?" but then waffle with (or whatever the explanation is) in the meat of your post. I wouldn't recommend a career in public debate for you.

[eclark53520]

Fastforward, it's amusing how you start with "Wanna bet?" but then waffle with (or whatever the explanation is) in the meat of your post. I wouldn't recommend a career in public debate for you.

OR physics...

[Pa Jayhawk]

Actually for a desired golf swing on a driver on hitting the ball as the club is on the upswing, I believe physics would likely support that if you hit the ball above the equator (or even on the equator), in relation to the direction of the clubface at impact, and on the bottom of the clubface where loft does not dictate the spin the ball would in fact start upwards based on the direction of the club, then spin downward. This is no different than what you would see hitting a baseball on the equator on an upswing. It is also really no different than how you achieve a slice on an outside in swing where the ball starts in relation to the club path. Just to a lesser degree because less of the face come in contact with a compressed ball, there bye imparting less spin. Simply put, just because the Bernoulli Effect is usually used in relation to defining lift does not mean that both it and the Magnus effect would not still hold true in relation to the spin on a golf ball with topspin is imparted and the spin of the ball is actually responsible for imparting the deflection of air. Kind like if you mounted a wing on an airplane upside down and have it take off on a ramp at a 10* angle. Also probably the reason wings are not round, because they are not spinning.

Although it would be hard to believe this happens with any form or regularity or if you are not "Topping" the ball so to speak. Simply because you are looking at just a lot smaller surface for which you must make contact for this to happen and not "shank" the ball into the ground there bye leaving visible skid marks on the tee box (Which could be another viable option for this). In order for it to happen on the sweet spot you would have to be bending the shaft past the point of the angle of the clubface at impact, which would seem almost impossible unless you are setting up entirely wrong or use a shaft flex similar to a Whippy Tempo Master. Where in relation that on a proper swing the shaft is actually usually flexing the other direction or towards the ball at impact.

[eclark53520]

The driver should contact the ball at a positive angle of attack, but its what like 2 or 3 degree's?

So hitting on the equator at even 4 degree's is going to launch the ball so low to the ground and the amount of forward spin would be negligable to say the least...launching that low it would have to have a rediculous amount of backspin to even stay above the ground for longer than 2 feet...

The fact of the matter is, yes its possible with extremely rare situations to get top spin on a ball, but is it possible to see the top spin to effect the balls flight dramatically enough for us to tell the difference between top spin(the negligable amount available within constraints of a golfball teed up and a driver) the and gravity without backspin?