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Thread: This makes me wanna puke.

  1. #1

    This makes me wanna puke.

    I can't friggin' believe this would come into effect. I would stop eating out. However, I have reservations, of which I will explain later...

    "NEW YORK - After finishing dinner at a Connecticut restaurant, two diners got more than a butter mint when a waiter, apparently miffed by a $2 to $3 tip left on a $50 check, attacked them with a knife. They only suffered minor injuries, but no doubt tipped much better after that.

    While violent cases of waiter rage are rare, the 1989 incident points to waiters' sticky reliance on tips for income. In some states, restaurants are only legally required to pay as little as $2 or $3 an hour. So if a server earns $30 in tips on a bad night, he could feasibly walk out having earned less than minimum wage after tipping out the bartender and busboys (a common practice in most restaurants).

    To level the playing field, waiters are taking action. Some are resorting to guerrilla tactics — it's not uncommon for waiters to personally confront stingy tippers, or to blog about them on sites such as WaiterRant.Net.

    One former waiter, Yakup Ulutas, is proposing restaurants change the system. Ulutas, a 36 year-old restaurant manager in Atlanta, founded a nonprofit organization, Fairtip.org, to persuade restaurants to implement an automatic 20 percent service fee on every check. He estimates 2,500 waiters have joined.

    You'd be hard-pressed to find a server who wouldn't love to see his or her employer slap an automatic tip on to every check. But wouldn't it make more sense for restaurants to hike prices by 20 percent and raise workers' salaries?

    "That wouldn't work," Yakup says. "Many restaurants wouldn't be able to afford to pay higher wages."

    The low-margin restaurant business is a notoriously difficult one. Raising server wages could easily zap the profits of small to mid-sized restaurants.

    But diners have also seen a rapid rise in the tipping rate. Zagat Survey, which surveys the top restaurants nationwide, found that the average tip has increased to 18.7 percent in 2006 from 17.75 percent in 2000.

    At least one academic thinks that if the tipping rate rises too high, eating out will become prohibitive for many people, and restaurant sales will stall.

    "Tipping is about buying social approval, and the way you do that is to at least tip an average amount, but most people want to tip a little bit better than average. That exerts an upward pressure on tips," says Michael Lynn, an associate professor at Cornell University School of Hotel Administration.

    It would make sense for the restaurant industry to establish a norm before tipping rates move up to the point of pricing diners out of the market, he said.

    While most restaurants already charge an automatic service fee for large parties, at least one restaurant began the practice of charging an automatic 20 percent gratuity, or "autograt," as it is sometimes called, on every check.

    Per Se, a pricey New York restaurant started by star chef Thomas Keller, caused a public outcry when it implemented a 20 percent service fee last year. All prix fixe menus at Per Se cost $210, according to the restaurant's web site, so assuming customers spend about $100 for wine, a tip is likely to total around $60. Still, the restaurant said no patrons have refused to pay the service fee, and some guests actually tip above the required amount.

    It may sound like a lucrative arrangement, but some waiters would rather take their chances and brave the risk of not making money.

    "For as much disappointment as there is in waiting tables, regulating tips might detract from the sense that if you do your job well, you'll be rewarded," says Melissa Klein, a 25 year-old waitress at Lodge restaurant in Brooklyn, N.Y.

    It's a common belief — that tips are based on service — but Lynn argues it's all wrong. Research has shown that tips are rarely based on the quality of service, and are usually determined arbitrarily.

    "Servers think there's a relationship between tips and service, but there isn't. How sunny it is outside literally has as big of an impact on a tip as the service," Lynn says.

    One study showed that when waitresses wore flowers in their hair they earned 17 percent more than when they didn't. Another study suggests that waiters who squat beside tables receive an average tip of 18 percent, versus a 15 percent tip received by waiters who stand next to their tables.

    Some waiters concede that tipping behavior has very little to do with service. Theresa Burkhart, a 31 year-old waitress and actress in Manhattan, says overtippers tend to overtip regardless of service, and undertippers tend to undertip; Canadians and Brits often tip 10 percent, while Japanese customers tip around 20 percent.

    Burkhart herself says she tips a minimum of 20 percent across the board.

    "I find it unacceptable for people not to know that the tipping rate is 20 percent," Burkhart said.

    The sentiment is widely shared on the Internet; a database started on one Web site — bitterwaitress.com — allows servers across the country to submit the names of customers who tipped less than 17 percent. Actress Sandra Bernhard is listed in the database for having skipped out on a tip after eating a $120 comped dinner at a Rochester, N.Y. club where she performed.

    While public humiliation may be a low blow, it's still preferable to stabbing stingy tippers."



    I tip based on service. Its the only way to guarantee that your service is good. If you tip arbitrarily, you're screwing the system up. Having an auto gratuity for groups makes sense, however, it should be noted that if your service stinks, you can negotiate that gratuity. Tips aren't a right, they are earned.

    However, whoever works in a restaurant or bar for $3 an hour and expects tips is a fool. How the hell can society "expect" tips from lacklustre performance?

    The article mentions Brits and Canadians tip around 10%. It's common practice around here that if your service sucks, you get nothing. If it's sub par, you get 5%. If it's nomical, you get 10% and if you do good work, it's 15%+. I've tipped as much as 25% when the service was outstanding.

    But what i can't get over is automatic tipping. That's like giving the government an extra 5% because your tax forms came in December. Big friggin' deal.

    If I was a waiter/busboy/bartender/ect., I would be working for my tips and NEVER expecting anything. If you do good work, most people see that and REWARD you for that. And working at a job for $3 an hour is ridiculous. Work at Walmart for $8 an hour, you'd end up making more per month than as a waiter who's mailing it in 8 hours a day.

    At least in Canada, you would.

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  2. #2
    wow.... a little long there rock? i got about 1/4 the way through it.... but yea, if they make the manditory tip, id nvr eat out. If i tip (im a teenager... so im pretty stingy on my $), i tip because i had good service, if the guy is walking around actin like a sh*t, hell like im tipping him.
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  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Rockford35 View Post
    And working at a job for $3 an hour is ridiculous.

    R35
    Rock $3 an hour plus tips can be pretty decent in the right restaurant. last time I ate out at a decent place I think dinner and a drink came to about $40 each so $80 bill and @20% is $16 so think I just left a C. she had three tables, figure we stayed 1-3/4 hours (probably less) so with reseating say 2 hours . $20 tip x 3 tables / 2 hours /2 for split with the bus/bar = $15 /hour + $3 wage = $18 hour net, a better than decent wage for around here. True, slow time / and prep time would cut into this but still decent.

    But I agree with you in ways about the autotipping. Usually it is kinda hidden and if you end up paying the gratuity and also tipping :dead: !!!

    It all boils down to responsibility, whose? with tips,the waiter is really almost self employed. So if they wanna in effect take the night off (i.e. just not in the mood to give it any effort that night), they can give you real slack service and all they lose is your tip. Unless really slack, what can the manager do? threaten to fire them? If them, I would just look at the manager, remind him about unemployment insurance rates, and tell him to take his $3 /hr and GF.

    But if the restaurant paid a good wage (say $12- 14?) and the help goes slacker on you, the management would get on their case cause 1. he doesn't want to lose your business, 2. He is paying $12/hr and wants his money's worth.
    Tipping makes them short term employees of yours, good wages make them longer term employees of the restaurant.

    you say "I tip based on service. Its the only way to guarantee that your service is good." Thats not a true statement. Your tip is made after service is performed, and in response to the quality of service recieved, but it in no way guarantees good service. You in a short term employment situation there and only by increasing the frequency of the employments (i.e. your repeat business and becoming know to the staff) will it have any effect on the quality of service.

    But yea, everybody wants your money, and in reality good people do good work regardless of the pay, and slackers slack no matter what they make.
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  4. #4
    I tip for service, having said that I did wait tables for a brief stint, and when my wife and I started this bussiness I delivered pizza in both cases I averaged 18-19 dollars an hour, thats 7 in hourly plus tips and minus gas for the pizza job. Maybe not great money by anyones standard but certainly not bad either.
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  5. I tip based on the waitress' looks and if they're stuck up or not ("waiters" get nothing). Nah, I like R35's idea and agree with it. I usually tip 20% if they do okay.
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  6. #6
    Here's a tip: get a haircut and bring my food out when it's still hot!

    jk,

    I generally tip a buck per person at lunch and two to three per person at dinner depending on the service. I don't care if my meal costs $10 or $30, the waitress still just takes the order and brings the food out either way. It's an easy freaking job, not brain surgery or anything so don't expect to make $50 bucks an hour just cause you decided to come into work that day and do your job. Sorry, but it's true.

    th

  7. #7
    If the restuarant played 12-14 per hour, there would be a friggin' lineup for people to take those jobs, so you better damn well do a good job or you're out on your ass.

    In all honesty, I wished that my tip was evenly distributed, but I know it's not. There's a dishwasher, a sous chef and a bartender mixing my drinks, yet they probably see little of that money. If I get great service, I have no problem dropping 20% on a bill. I like to positively reward the gal or guy that's helping is with our meal so that the next group that comes by gets the same service. Whether they tip as well as I do it out of my hands, but at least i'm doing my job of either paving the road to a good serviced meal or getting the complete wastes of space out of the service industry.

    R35
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  8. someplaces do add the tip right into your bill.i believe when 9 of us went to Red Lobster a yr ago at the bottom of the bill it had a tip amount on there.although we ended up leaving another $30-$40 on the table.our company paid for the meal.

    i usualy tip around 15-20% unless shes a hottie then its more apt to be 25%.
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  9. Tips??????????!

    Tips???!

    Heck, as a newly finished student I can't afford to tip anyone!

    Which reminds me, the other day I paid a waitress after treating my children to some cakes at a cafe. She seemed to take ages bringing back the change, so I had to ask for my change when I saw her but she didn't seem too happy that i had asked for it and she reluctantly gave this to me! The change came to just over £2 whereby I put the money to treating my children to sweets afterwards! *tuts* Anyone would think I was made of money or something!

    Maybe it was because she was Polish, she didn't understand the language well and she didn't realize that one should return the change unless one is told to keep it as a tip!
    Last edited by smileyrose; 09-13-2006 at 02:12 PM.

  10. We eat out a lot, as a couple and also with friends, lunches, dinners etc. The average tip I'd say is about 20%

    The servers here make a lot more than 3$ per hour too. Hell, you start at McDonalds at 9$/hr....
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  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by VtDivot View Post
    We eat out a lot, as a couple and also with friends, lunches, dinners etc. The average tip I'd say is about 20%

    The servers here make a lot more than 3$ per hour too. Hell, you start at McDonalds at 9$/hr....
    But is your tip dependent on the service? I mean, if you don't get asked what you want to drink for 20 minutes and your food come out cold, do you still leave 20%?

    R35
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    Too many churches and not enough truth...

  12. #12
    I tip 15% of the total 90% of the time. 5% of the time the service sux and I tip less, even down to zero. In these cases, the waiter has been told verbally that we did not like his/her service at all.

    When I get exceptional service, I go as high as 25% but this is rare.

    We have an extremely high number of restaurants here and three universities. The college kids work at the chains and professional waiters work at the chef-owned restaurants, often for decades...

    I waited tables in college and delivered pizzas. I saw the crappy end of tipping from people who would give me a quarter.

    When I got a quarter, I would walk up to them as they were paying their tab at the front counter and say,

    "Here's your quarter back..you need it more than I do".

  13. Grateful!

    A tip should be left up to one's discretion. If one feels that they can afford to leave a reasonable tip for the service they've been given, then that should be left entirely up to each individual concerned.

    However, one should never expect a tip and people should be grateful if they get one, no matter how much it is!

  14. #14
    Well stated, SR!

  15. Smiles

    Thanks and I have been known to tip before, but very rarely and the service would have to be very good for me to even consider tipping someone!

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