The Pelz effect

[dave.]

Mickelsons game just seems to get worse.Is this is a small slump,starting from the US Open,or is there something else?

He misses so many putts now,his short game feel has gone nuts and he just can't score,yet he still insists on using Pelz who is great for handicappers,but does a player like Mickelson really need this much instruction? Phil has been compared to Seve,did Seve go to someone like 'Eddie' and ask for advice? Its seems to me the modern thing of using all these gurus may not be working in his case.Seeing Eddie stride into Augusta made me wonder,what the hell has he got to teach Mickelson? Tom Kite once had a guru,Harvey,and he gave him one liners thats all,such as once when Kite's feel went he noticed he wasn't following though,even on short chips.I can relate to this and I am sure Seve has taken such tips from his brothers or fellow pros.But all this technical guff coming from Pelz and his son? I dunno,they may be great,I just can't relate to such an accomplished player needing all this work.

[gwlee7]

I guess "chip it under the bench" isn't complicated enough.

[sandwedge]

I think Pelz's take on the short game is too scientific for a player like Phil. I think most great short game players rely on feel more than mechanics and using an exact system like Pelz teaches.

I have the short game bible and though I liked some of his ideas and found some of his studies interesting it didn't suit my game. Not that I am a great short game player or even a good one but I like to go by feel more than anything.

In my opinion Pelz does a great job of selling himself and his scientific philosophy but offers no more than many other instuctors.

[ezra76]

Maybe. I would think Phil would be able to teach Pelz a thing or two. I only caught a few of his miscues and it looks like he's too tenative around the greens. Short game is the one area he should stay agressive, his style.

I've never read his stuff but have seen a little on the GC. I keep mine simple, hit the back of the cup and my spots on chips and I'm fine. I need to practice putting more and at least hit some before playing on the practice greens. Unfortunately the one at my course is always closed for some reason. I think they "save" it for when tournaments come in.

[chemboy2]

Phil's short game was/is all about confidence and aggression. I don't think his problem is with Pelz but rather it is a lingering affect from the US Open. He had worked hard to get the no major monkey off his back and then in the matter of two swings of the club that monkey, and all its friends, jumped right back on. He failed to execuste on arguably the largest stage. I don't care what he says, until he gets with a solid sport psychologist that can help get that crap out of his head he won't be the same.

He may have won Pebble this year but he didn't do it convincingly. The week after he totally let Nissan slip away. Even though Pebble was a win, I think Nissan showed that the self-doubt is very much still there.

[Stanters]

It looks like a clash of styles and temprament to me.

Phail is all about imagination and touch whereas Pelz is a man of science and logic.

I think that perhaps Pelz has suffocated Phil's creativity. It's possible that now he thinks too much rather than going with natural instinct which suits his flair based approach.

Faldo and Leadbetter were of the same mindset and it worked for Nick but he still suffered from paralysis by analysis at times but Pelz and Mickelson might just be too different to work together.

[dave.]

I agree,hence I think 10 minutes drinking beer with Seve will work ten times better than any amount of time with Eddie and a robot putter.Such a wonderful player like Phil does not need a shutter door to learn with

[Pa Jayhawk]

I have to wonder how much of his short game woes is in relation to his new concept of wanting to carry 2 drivers and mixing up his bag. Seems like he is spending more time and more clubs on other parts of his game at the expense of his short game. No amount of teaching will help some of his putting problems like the 3 foot putt. You either have it or you don't, maybe a sports psychologist would be of more use for his putting.

As far as short game, speaking from my experience consistancy is directly related to familiarity with clubs. If I started pulling wedges out of my bag and changing them around, it is unlikely I would have as good of a short game. Hard for me to blame Pelz, who preaches 4 or more wedges. Mickleson seems to be headed the opposite direction. Maybe more of a sign that there is some merit to more wedges leading to a better short game. That is the part of my game where I score, leading me to want to dedicate more clubs and more options to the cause.

[ualtim]

Originally Posted by dave.

Tom Kite once had a guru,Harvey,and he gave him one liners thats all,such as once when Kite's feel went he noticed he wasn't following though,even on short chips.I can relate to this and I am sure Seve has taken such tips from his brothers or fellow pros.But all this technical guff coming from Pelz and his son? I dunno,they may be great,I just can't relate to such an accomplished player needing all this work.

FYI....Tom Kite used Pelz as a short game instructor. It was Pelz's instruction that gave him the idea to start using the 60* Lob Wedge when he started winning all that money on tour. Kite has been called the "godfather of the 60* wedge", but the inspiration came from Pelz.

Like him or hate, Pelz's instruction works for some people. Its up to the individual golfer whether or not Pelz's methods will work for them or not.

[BStone]

Dave Pelz is a very good instructor when it comes to technique, Phil's shots are mostly based on feel and instinct. I think that Pelz is too analytical for Phil and he should stick to his first instinct, he is better with a flop shot than a straight forward chip, this defies the logic of golf for most players.

[dave.]

Good points Tim,but I am not advocating Pelz doesn't work for all players,i am sure he must be a talented coach,I am just musing about whether such a talented touch player like Mickelson can possibly learn anything from someone like Pelz

[ualtim]

Originally Posted by dave.

Good points Tim,but I am not advocating Pelz doesn't work for all players,i am sure he must be a talented coach,I am just musing about whether such a talented touch player like Mickelson can possibly learn anything from someone like Pelz

I agree with you on Mickelson. I don't think Pelz style meshes with his style, but its hard to argue with 3 majors since they have been working together. The one thing I do know is that Dave will not be enrolling in the Pelz school anytime soon.

[dave.]

Originally Posted by ualtim

I agree with you on Mickelson. I don't think Pelz style meshes with his style, but its hard to argue with 3 majors since they have been working together. The one thing I do know is that Dave will not be enrolling in the Pelz school anytime soon.

Thats an easy bet I suppose this thread was inspired by Eddie,his son,seeing him striding into Augusta as the commentator announced Eddie was also working with Phil.Thats just laughable.

[charnockpro]

Its like any teacher pupil relationship, ok it has garnered majors but there comes a time when like Faldo and leadbetter, Harmon and Woods, O'Grady and Seve that they are no longer advancing from their allaince that it is time to maybe call it a day.