Is Tiger on the Ragin' Roids?

[Clugnut]

I have been very amused by the Barry Bonds talk in the last year. Someone who has now broken an incredible record, yet it has been tarnished by accusations, unproven accusations I might add. I know that Mr. Bonds is not the amazing media machine that Mr. Woods is, and that he is less likable and more stand-offish, but Barry is an amazing athlete.

Anyway, lately the supposed proof of drug use has come in the form of pictures showing Bonds early in his career, and him now. Of course, early pictures show a tall, skinny Bonds, and the late pics show a totally jacked Bonds. NOT UNLIKE TIGER WOODS!!

So, I pose the question. Is Tiger Woods on steriods?

[TheWOAT]

Bonds, in leaked grand jury testimony, basically said he used some clear and cream substances provided by his trainer. His trainer admitted to what the cream and clear were... Besides that, his hat and shoe size have increased, pointing to some sort of juice use. And Im a Barry Bonds and SF Giants fan.

TW... went from slim to built in what? 10 years? If he had done it in 3 years, then that would raise red flags, but since that is not the case, Ill give him the benefit of the doubt.

[JEFF4i]

Are you serious?

If you sincerely think that Tiger has to prove himself as innocent, then perhaps the problem is on your end.

Now if you aren't entirely serious, then no. I don't think he is. As WOAT said, you can see the progression of muscle mass in the past 11 years.

[Clugnut]

Originally Posted by JEFF4i

If you sincerely think that Tiger has to prove himself as innocent, then perhaps the problem is on your end.

This isn't to create venom, Jeff. Just honest questions. The evidence some people use are before and after pictures. I'm just saying, if it wasn't for the face and the uniform, I personally don't think you could tell a difference.

I don't think Tiger is juicing, I just love the pile on effect that the sports fan lemmings take.

BTW, Jeff, if Tiger had lost today, would you have been in the chorus of those saying it was because he hurt his knee during his fist pump on 8?

I have heard the grand jury evidence bit before, but I think that Bonds maintains that he didn't know what he was taking. If it were Tiger saying it, everyone would believe it. But its Bonds, so they line up to crucify him.

[Clugnut]

Originally Posted by TheWOAT

Besides that, his hat and shoe size have increased, pointing to some sort of juice use.

That is interesting, I didn't hear that one. Did they measure his pecker, too?

[JEFF4i]

Originally Posted by Clugnut

This isn't to create venom, Jeff. Just honest questions. The evidence some people use are before and after pictures. I'm just saying, if it wasn't for the face and the uniform, I personally don't think you could tell a difference.

I don't think Tiger is juicing, I just love the pile on effect that the sports fan lemmings take.

BTW, Jeff, if Tiger had lost today, would you have been in the chorus of those saying it was because he hurt his knee during his fist pump on 8?

I have heard the grand jury evidence bit before, but I think that Bonds maintains that he didn't know what he was taking. If it were Tiger saying it, everyone would believe it. But its Bonds, so they line up to crucify him.

My apologies,

Honestly, you just need to break it down. Barry Bonds before and after is convincing, and so is Tiger Woods'. But look at the time frames. It's certainly justifiable.

Oh, and I would never be suprised if they pointed at Tiger, but I believe he is of character and honesty that it will slide off.

Oh, and if he lost today, I don't think it was because his knee, I'd think it's because he didn't make the swing he needed to, regardless of circumstances.

True though, most of America loves Tiger.

[Clugnut]

Originally Posted by JEFF4i

My apologies,
True though, most of America loves Tiger.

Yeah, Jeff, sorry. This thread isn't having the desired effect. I'm just trying to understand the Tiger Woods hysteria.

Here are two top tier athletes, both excelling in their sports, and one is villified, and the other is treated almost as a messiah. Anyone who think they might have the skill to beat Tiger is demonized and call either ****y or mentally challenged. Freakin Macatee today, and that comment on him hurting his knee (I knew you'd be on the right side of that one, Jeff!) and not birdieing every hole he played after that, sent me over the edge.

Personally, I'm not a Tiger fan. And sadly, it is not his fault. I like to see him play well, and he handles himself incredibly well. It just the media and some of his fans. Please get a grip. Even Tiger doesn't win every tournament, so some weeks, he isn't the best in the world. Overall, of course he is the best. But unbeatable? Not even close. Not even 50 percent of the time.

[JEFF4i]

Yeah, I will say, as with most celebreties, you find that the media creates an image that is very unlike the one they pick.

[TheWOAT]

Originally Posted by Clugnut

That is interesting, I didn't hear that one. Did they measure his pecker, too?

I think they are trying to subpeona that evidence.


Somewhat related note. The game Bonds hit #756, they played words of encourage and congrats from sports superstars. Jordan, Gretsky, Rice, Ali, and others , all made video comments. Last week, the C.O.O of the SF Giants noted on the radio that only one sports star refused to take part... he wouldnt say who, but it was obviously TW.. I guess he wanted nothing to do with Bonds.

[warbirdlover]

Tiger built a workout area with all the top equipment. He's bulking out the "legal" way. This is a crock.

[Libre]

I don't think Bonds is getting the credit he deserves - but comparing him to Woods is way off base. I mean, it's out of the park! Bonds is a great slugger - but nobody suggests he's the best baseball player ever - do they? Nobody says that he's possibly the best ATHLETE ever - do they? No - he competes in a team sport, in which hitting a ball hard enough between 2 foul poles hundreds of feet apart results in a home run. Not necessarily a W for the team - but a home run. I'm no baseball fan, but correct me if I'm wrong - Bonds is a DH and does nothing except come to the plate and try to hit home runs. And he's hit more of them than any other player ever. Quite an accomplishment. On the other hand, Woods is a man who has captured the hearts of the world. He has shown us sportsmanship and excellence beyond our imaginations. He competes in a sport where a single mistake can result in the loss of a championship - or where the lack of guts or concentration can be disasterous. If Bonds strikes out or hits into a double play, he just walks back into the dugout.
From an early age Woods' brilliance was apparent - but to carry that through into adulthood, and become the great champion that he has is awesome beyond belief! There is NO comparing Bonds to Woods - it's ridiculous.
When Woods first turned pro, he stated a clear goal - to surpass Jack Nicholas in majors. And he quickly showed us it was no idle - pie in the sky fantasy. He's revolutionized the game. He's the first golfer in history that practically EVERY SINGLE PERSON in the UNIVERSE knows and admires.
We're seeing the greatest player ever, before our eyes. It's a privelage to do so.
And, now to suggest Woods is doping, without ANY evidence or REASON for saying so is wrong, in my opinion. As if huge muscles would make him any better of a golfer anyway. Ridiculous!

[J.J.]

i saw tiger in person on thursday.. standing within 5 feet of him.. he is NOT big.. hes not small either.. but he is far from big.. his arms are cut like hell though.. theres no chance in hell tiger is juicin

[Clugnut]

Originally Posted by Libre

I don't think Bonds is getting the credit he deserves - but comparing him to Woods is way off base. I mean, it's out of the park! Bonds is a great slugger - but nobody suggests he's the best baseball player ever - do they? Nobody says that he's possibly the best ATHLETE ever - do they? No - he competes in a team sport, in which hitting a ball hard enough between 2 foul poles hundreds of feet apart results in a home run. Not necessarily a W for the team - but a home run. I'm no baseball fan, but correct me if I'm wrong - Bonds is a DH and does nothing except come to the plate and try to hit home runs. And he's hit more of them than any other player ever. Quite an accomplishment. On the other hand, Woods is a man who has captured the hearts of the world. He has shown us sportsmanship and excellence beyond our imaginations. He competes in a sport where a single mistake can result in the loss of a championship - or where the lack of guts or concentration can be disasterous. If Bonds strikes out or hits into a double play, he just walks back into the dugout.
From an early age Woods' brilliance was apparent - but to carry that through into adulthood, and become the great champion that he has is awesome beyond belief! There is NO comparing Bonds to Woods - it's ridiculous.
When Woods first turned pro, he stated a clear goal - to surpass Jack Nicholas in majors. And he quickly showed us it was no idle - pie in the sky fantasy. He's revolutionized the game. He's the first golfer in history that practically EVERY SINGLE PERSON in the UNIVERSE knows and admires.
We're seeing the greatest player ever, before our eyes. It's a privelage to do so.
And, now to suggest Woods is doping, without ANY evidence or REASON for saying so is wrong, in my opinion. As if huge muscles would make him any better of a golfer anyway. Ridiculous!

Well, thank you for the example of the Tiger fan. I hope you have a good job, man. It'll take a darn big engagement ring for Tiger to say yes!

[Wi-Golfer]

Originally Posted by Libre

As if huge muscles would make him any better of a golfer anyway. Ridiculous!

Exactly!
How would that help his short game including putting? Hell Tiger isn't even one of the longest hitters anymore. There are plenty others who surpass him in that area & that's about all steroids would be good for.

As far as his build goes, he was a skinny assed 20 yr old kid who's metabolism has finally slowed down & he has gained weight. he controls the the weight by working out & it shows.

[The Salt Vampire]

Kind of around the subject, but I hope my points are valid.

The link below is to a great column that Michael Wilbon wrote this week:

washingtonpost.com - nation, world, technology and Washington area news and headlines

I hope the link works. Sometimes you have to sign in. The column is called "Plenty of Holes in Pockets of Resistance". It is about Bonds and Lance Armstrong, but the gist of it is that, "We give the benefit of the doubt to people we like". I don't think Tiger did steroids, but I like him and would give him the benefit of the doubt.

Also, Gary Player keeps bringing up golfers using HGH, steroids and Creatine. Unless, I missed something Creatine is legal and I would assume many pro golfers use it.

It is readily found in all kinds of food and nearly impossible to test for. People that work out find it helpful to build and maintain muscle. In every locker room in every pro sports league it is common. It is approved by the FDA.