One plane swing help.

[todd]

I have recently converted to a one plane swing, however I'am hitting all my irons fat now. Really fat. Driver, 3 wood, hybrids, no problem. Just the irons, including full wedge shots. I have read every book on the one plane swing but still chunk city. Would love to hear your guys advice. Thank you.

[Bignose]

Are you really and truly using no hands in the shot at all? Are you really and truly starting the swing with only the hips and maybe the shoulders (Not the arms/hands)?

The reason I ask is because I find that I start hitting it fat when I revert back to old habits of throwing my hands down toward the ball, and not starting the swing with only the hips and letting the hands go "along for the ride".

[Adam Pettman]

Weight transfer during your swing might be an issue.

[crackedup]

This may help, a buddy of mine sent me this when I was doing the same thing.

"One of the most common causes of this is when the arms release too early in the swing and body stops its rotation to the left. As you have learned, as soon as the body stops or slows its rotation, the passive arms have the opportunity to “catch up” to the body and release off the chest. If the body has not properly cleared to the left to give the arms room to swing through, the club will be slung down too steeply toward the ground. It is critical for the body to keep rotating to the left while keeping the arms passive to avoid this common miss. It is also very critical that the golfer never try and actively use the arms to generate clubhead speed as this will cause the arms to release from the body too early in the swing."

Good Luck.

[Res Ipsa]

Whose One Plane Swing are you trying to duplicate?

Bignose is properly describing the passive arms type of OPS for more help maybe check out Chuck Quinton's teachings. (there might be alot of teachers who teach this swing but I don't know much about it and his name is the only one that I can remember)

I, on the other hand, am a fan of the Jim Hardy OPS. In that swing you do release your arms. Personally, I trust Hardy's method and there is alot of info about this type of swing. Start by buying both of his books. Read the "Plane Truth" first and then read "Masters Class" (if you are more of a video learner he has videos too which are extremely helpful). In Masters Class he describes faults and fixes. Basically he narrows down what you are doing wrong and some tools to get you back on track. (I do not have the book with me or I would just tell you what he says)

My guess as to why you are hitting fat is improper weight transfer/distribution. Remember in almost all OPS there is minimal transfer of weight to the right (back) leg during the backswing. JH even advocates no weight transfer. He says start with 60% of weight on left (front) leg and increase the percentage at the start of the downswing until impact is around 75% and of course at finish nearly all your wieght.

PS. unless someone gives you advice tailored to a OPS their advice probably won't help your particular swing.

[jambalaya]

I recently converted too and have had the same problem. I hit a few very chunky ones in my last range session. I got the same advice these guys are giving.

[dave.]

IMo, you don't have to delve into the depths of different swing theories to figure out why you are hitting the ball fat, players have hit fat shots since the game was invented. One of the most common reasons is leaving the weight on the back foot, ie not getting it across to the left.

[Bignose]

Originally Posted by dave.

IMo, you don't have to delve into the depths of different swing theories to figure out why you are hitting the ball fat, players have hit fat shots since the game was invented. One of the most common reasons is leaving the weight on the back foot, ie not getting it across to the left.

There's a lot of truth in this.

Which spurred another thought, another reason for fat shots is not getting the hands out in front of the ball at impact. Concentrating on getting the hands in front of the ball before the club gets there and that basically will eliminate fat shots. You may start getting thin shots, but it will cure the fats.

[todd]

I wasn't aware of the different types of one plane swings, however I believe Hardy's swing will suit me better. I find it very hard to have passive hands in a swing. I feel very stuck when I do that. I'am headed out to the range now to implement all of the good advice I have received. It is great to find a sight like this. Thanx ....

[Res Ipsa]

Originally Posted by todd

I wasn't aware of the different types of one plane swings, however I believe Hardy's swing will suit me better. I find it very hard to have passive hands in a swing. I feel very stuck when I do that. I'am headed out to the range now to implement all of the good advice I have received. It is great to find a sight like this. Thanx ....

I think you misunderstood what I said about Hardy's swing. The hands ARE more or less passive in JH OPS. One of the advantages of his OPS swing is that there is no rotation of the hands inorder to RELEASE the club. Instead the release is done with the arms (side note: the clubhead stays even with the hands; the hands should not be infront of the clubhead at impact).

Its the ARMS that are active as opposed to some other one planers who believe in passive arms (body turns and arms along for the ride as they usually say).

Hardy's catch phrase is:
“WHILE TURNING YOUR BODY, YOU THROW YOUR ARMS AROUND YOUR BODY”, or “WHILE THROWING YOUR ARMS AROUND YOUR BODY, YOU TURN YOUR BODY”

That is a direct quote and is sorta the mantra of his OPS. Get the book/s I promise JH is much better at explaining it than I am.

[todd]

I will locate and purchase the book this evening, good timing since I'am rained out from the range. Do you find this swing tricky at 100yds or less? I assume a little more attention must be in order to prevent over swinging on "feel" shots.

[Res Ipsa]

Originally Posted by todd

I will locate and purchase the book this evening, good timing since I'am rained out from the range. Do you find this swing tricky at 100yds or less? I assume a little more attention must be in order to prevent over swinging on "feel" shots.

You are very perceptive. The partial shots are my weakness and am working it out myself. JH has video on covering the subject but I have not acquired it yet.

I don't think your short game swing should really be a mini version of your full swing anyways. I try to keep my full swing and my short game separate.

I am toying with the idea of moving to more of a Pelz style short game which is more like a traditional golf swing but the feel for the shot is much more apparent.

[dave.]

The main problem i have with Hardy is the fact he says you can hit as hard as you want from the top, it doesn't matter, yet he also says you have passive hands (and alligator arms whatever). Yet Hogan and Penick both said the hands are passive, the 'whip' is caused by the bottom half dragging the turning top half down and its the ROTATION of the forearms that create real speed. Hardy and CQ are nothing new imo, just the same old dressed in new clothes.

[charnockpro]

Originally Posted by dave.

The main problem i have with Hardy is the fact he says you can hit as hard as you want from the top, it doesn't matter, yet he also says you have passive hands (and alligator arms whatever). Yet Hogan and Penick both said the hands are passive, the 'whip' is caused by the bottom half dragging the turning top half down and its the ROTATION of the forearms that create real speed. Hardy and CQ are nothing new imo, just the same old dressed in new clothes.

This is becoming a habit agreeing with you Dave!!, I respect Mr Hardy and his theorum, what i dont subscribe to is a certain "system" i don't think you can have two people of a different height, weight,build etc.. swing exactly the same, i had the same problem with Leadbetter and to a certain extent Harmon who teach very definable technique, i think the best teachers adapt to the physical limitations of the player and work with them to develop the best pattern available, if you feel like the OPS is the way to go then thats fine, but then the weaknesses with adaption for the short game would worry me as i would have thought that once you have found your particular shape and technique you would be able to adapt this to a lot of shots.

[dave.]

Yes, and I also have a problem with the theory that the OPS is 'swing'. It isn't in my opinion, its just swinging on the shoulder plane, or the plane as defined by Hogan, whatever you prefer. I can't see how and why something as simple as being on plane needs a whole swing theory behind it. These guys build a theory AROUND the plane, in my opinion Hogan regarded the plane as one part of it, there were component parts and they all play a part. But who am I , these theories are not for me, I've used the Fundamentals for too long