I have the arms of a full-grown ape...HELP!!!

[jonjoyner83]

Hi guys,

I have just decided to take up golf in the past 2 months. I bought an el-cheapo set of clubs from Target as a starting point. Keeping in mind that my clubs aren't top-notch, I did this as to avoid a $500 investment on what I already have experienced as a frustrating game. Here is the issue at hand:

I can hit my irons very well. Unfortunately, I cracked my 3I wide open today. The club face is warped and cracked so it is a goner. Previous to this happening, I would hit well over 200 yards with my 3I straight as an arrow. This was after a good bit of technique adjustments and such.

I can put satisfactory. On the fast green at the range, I can sink 40-50 footers on a slope no problem. I feel this aspect won't bug me too much.

My woods and driver performance SUCK. I can't hit a straight shot off of low tee, high tee, or fairway height. Everytime I swing, the club smacks the ground and then bounces up at the ball. This of course causes major issues. So I took some measurements. This is what shocked me.

I am 5'10" tall. My inseam is 30 inches. My driver is a 400cc 45" shaft graphite club. Other people can hit with it fine. I can't. I measured my reach to the ground. Get this: From my finger tips to my arches in a straight-back stance is 23.5"!!!! Not even 2 feet off the ground. I'm a friggin' neanderthal. This is where my issues stems.

What can I do about this? Can I cut my shaft to 40" and not suffer a lose of distance? Can I learn to swing a driver like an ape would sling a wooden club? I am in need of help as I do love the game, I hate jackin' my wrists up each time I try to drive with my woods.

Thanks...

[Davebud]

My finger tips are only 23 inches from the ground, flatten your swing plane. One of the 2 things I can do decently well is drive the ball. Last Monday I was driving for Sh!t and still going 260-270. When I am on it, I get 300+ yards on a drive and mostly straight.

[jonjoyner83]

Should I stand fairly straight or bend at the knees at address? Flatten my swing plane as in my backswing goes under my back shoulder and not up to my back shoulder? I am not disagreeing with you as you are obviously hitting much better than I am, but won't a flatter swing plane cause some erratic ball flight?

[SilverUberXeno]

I've found this to be a basic, solid address setup.

Base every change you make on your 7 iron. In theory, you can make par with a 7 iron and a putter. This is why we start here.

Ground the club a cm behind the ball so the face is square. Now get your feet in a position where you're holding the club comfortably, and your arms are hanging almost straight down. To make sure you're not too far back or too far forward, release the club with your right hand and let it hang. It should move to the right to hang underneath your shoulder, but it shouldn't move toward the ball or toward your body. If it does, consider adjusting where you stand.

Your knees should bend, and you should be leaning over (bend at the hips) to balance yourself around the balls of your feet. Don't be too heavy on your heels. Your right foot should make a 90 degree angle with the target line. Your left foot can open if it helps you turn through later.

On the back-swing, do NOT sway. It's common for beginners to sway because they think they're being tough. Twist instead. Your shoulders should turn enough to point your back at the target. It's fine not to go that far if you can't control the club well enough yet, but you should never go BEYOND that point.

Your hips will naturally follow your shoulders to some extent; let them. Your shoulders should turn about 90 degrees, and your hips about 45. Try not to let the club go past parallel (to the ground), and do your best to keep your left arm straight. MINOR bend at the elbow is alright, but more than that is risking a lot of lost power and control.

** Crucial point.
The reason you're hitting the ground is because you're dipping your shoulders, I believe. Once you've mastered turning your body instead of swaying, this is one of the only reasons you can chunk the ground before the ball. TURN your shoulders. SWEEP your shoulders. Do NOT dip. I'm guessing that when you start your downswing, your left shoulder rises and your right shoulder falls. Occasionally this will warrant a good shot. Occasionally means you'll be swimming and hiking to find the ball you just shanked with your pitching wedge.

Practice swinging slowly until you get a feel for the sweeping shoulders. You want to come down on the ball with your arms, not your shoulders. Your waist should stay level, and your shoulders should stay level through the ball.

Another important lesson.. don't try to crush the ball. Would you rather be 200 yards up and 20 yards into the woods, or 150 yards up in the middle of the fairway? You want power, but you NEED accuracy.

Also: Note the position of your left hand at address, and try to bring it back to that position at impact. It'll help you figure out where the face it. Work it into your swing smoothly; don't try to jerk the club right when you're about to hit the ball. You should open the face on the backswing, bring it to impact square, and finish closed.

| Address
/ Backswing (continuing to open)
/ Downswing (beginning to close)
| Impact
\ Finish

If that ^ confuses you, ignore it. Good luck.

[SilverUberXeno]

And to clear up your swing-plane question, consider that your swing plane should be flatter depending on how long your club is. You should swing your driver flatter than your 3 iron. You should swing your p-wedge less-flat than your 7 iron. Don't let your swing get uncomfortable, just know that it does change a little bit with every club. It's all about what you need to do to reach the ball. Whatever plane you leave the ball with, try to come down on the same one.

[ezra76]

I have a DVD I got when I first started playing by Wally Armstrong. He uses a lot of props to simplify the explanation of all these technical sounding golf swing things. He used a hula-hoop around his shoulders to explain swing plane and how it should change with the length of club. It made sense right off the bat to me. Practice with a half swing with the driver and lengthen your swing as you start to make more solid contact. I do this to some extent when I am not hitting it square. Once I've grooved my contact I can swing as hard as I want.

[jonjoyner83]

I completely understand everyting you said here (even the little graph at the bottom). I know I am not swaying, 100% sure of it. On my backswing, my shoulders TURN first and then my hips follow them. Naturally this cause me to sink some in my stance. I don't dip down a great bit, but I do shorten about 3/4 of an inch.

I think my problem is I am swinging my driver like I would my 3I. When I address with my 3I, my arms hang down straight and I lean over somewhat. As I backswing, my club face does open up and at the top of my backswing, the club points down range. I know my tempo is fine as it takes my probably 4 seconds to complete a full swing (maybe too slow?). I know my turn is good and my release is square because all of my irons hit straight and solid. I have plenty of loft. In fact, I feel good knowing that I have a great shot with my long irons when beginners really struggle with these. My 3I is an average 220yd shot with about 100yd loft (I guess) and my 4I is about 30yds shy of that (give or take windage). Essentially, my iron shots are acceptable to me.

What I have tried since last night has improved my confidence some. I imagine there is a line coming across my right shoulder straight out (as your right shoulder is somewhat lower than left at address). I make sure my swing plane stays further under that line as I swing the longer clubs. When I swing my PW, I am almost on top of the ball and swinging really close to my body. My right elbow is always hinged and tucked into my side, so no chicken wing. I am going to the range today, I will report back. I want to video my technique, I will try to get that back to you for critique. I think my next error will be too flat of a swing.

Originally Posted by SilverUberXeno

I've found this to be a basic, solid address setup.

Base every change you make on your 7 iron. In theory, you can make par with a 7 iron and a putter. This is why we start here.

Ground the club a cm behind the ball so the face is square. Now get your feet in a position where you're holding the club comfortably, and your arms are hanging almost straight down. To make sure you're not too far back or too far forward, release the club with your right hand and let it hang. It should move to the right to hang underneath your shoulder, but it shouldn't move toward the ball or toward your body. If it does, consider adjusting where you stand.

Your knees should bend, and you should be leaning over (bend at the hips) to balance yourself around the balls of your feet. Don't be too heavy on your heels. Your right foot should make a 90 degree angle with the target line. Your left foot can open if it helps you turn through later.

On the back-swing, do NOT sway. It's common for beginners to sway because they think they're being tough. Twist instead. Your shoulders should turn enough to point your back at the target. It's fine not to go that far if you can't control the club well enough yet, but you should never go BEYOND that point.

Your hips will naturally follow your shoulders to some extent; let them. Your shoulders should turn about 90 degrees, and your hips about 45. Try not to let the club go past parallel (to the ground), and do your best to keep your left arm straight. MINOR bend at the elbow is alright, but more than that is risking a lot of lost power and control.

** Crucial point.
The reason you're hitting the ground is because you're dipping your shoulders, I believe. Once you've mastered turning your body instead of swaying, this is one of the only reasons you can chunk the ground before the ball. TURN your shoulders. SWEEP your shoulders. Do NOT dip. I'm guessing that when you start your downswing, your left shoulder rises and your right shoulder falls. Occasionally this will warrant a good shot. Occasionally means you'll be swimming and hiking to find the ball you just shanked with your pitching wedge.

Practice swinging slowly until you get a feel for the sweeping shoulders. You want to come down on the ball with your arms, not your shoulders. Your waist should stay level, and your shoulders should stay level through the ball.

Another important lesson.. don't try to crush the ball. Would you rather be 200 yards up and 20 yards into the woods, or 150 yards up in the middle of the fairway? You want power, but you NEED accuracy.

Also: Note the position of your left hand at address, and try to bring it back to that position at impact. It'll help you figure out where the face it. Work it into your swing smoothly; don't try to jerk the club right when you're about to hit the ball. You should open the face on the backswing, bring it to impact square, and finish closed.

| Address
/ Backswing (continuing to open)
/ Downswing (beginning to close)
| Impact
\ Finish

If that ^ confuses you, ignore it. Good luck.

[Davebud]

last week or ths week and the point was that when hitting your driver, your stance should be like you are resting your butt on the edge of a bar stool. Just enough to catch the lip of the stool, without actually sitting on it, like leaning you butt against it. As far as how close I am to the ball, with my wedge the ball is roughly 11 inches from the tips of my toes away, 3 iron set up is about 21 inches away, but with the driver I am set up 32 inches away from the tips of my toes. My driver is only 5 inches longer than my 3 iron, but I am trying to come in at a much shallower swing plane. These are not going to be exact measurements, but they are all with in a half inch, I set up in the garage with each club just like I would out on the range and these were the numbers I got with my tape measure. So you really want to get that groove that works for you, another quick tip I have seen on TGC, swing your driver a chest height, like a baseball bat a few times, lower your swing plane a few inches and keep swinging. Keep swinging and every couple of swings drop the plane another few inches, just before you start to hit the ground, note how far you are from your body with the head of the club. That is very close to where you should be teeing up the ball.
While I realize there is a lot to learn at this game, I am just trying to help you out with a couple of the tips that worked for me, us freakish long armed mutants need to stick together.

[jonjoyner83]

Only one thing goes through my mind before I hit my driver.....
"HULK SMASH!!!!"

I took your advice and hit with a flat plane. I can hit the ball now, it just doesn't go straight like my irons.

Originally Posted by Davebud

last week or ths week and the point was that when hitting your driver, your stance should be like you are resting your butt on the edge of a bar stool. Just enough to catch the lip of the stool, without actually sitting on it, like leaning you butt against it. As far as how close I am to the ball, with my wedge the ball is roughly 11 inches from the tips of my toes away, 3 iron set up is about 21 inches away, but with the driver I am set up 32 inches away from the tips of my toes. My driver is only 5 inches longer than my 3 iron, but I am trying to come in at a much shallower swing plane. These are not going to be exact measurements, but they are all with in a half inch, I set up in the garage with each club just like I would out on the range and these were the numbers I got with my tape measure. So you really want to get that groove that works for you, another quick tip I have seen on TGC, swing your driver a chest height, like a baseball bat a few times, lower your swing plane a few inches and keep swinging. Keep swinging and every couple of swings drop the plane another few inches, just before you start to hit the ground, note how far you are from your body with the head of the club. That is very close to where you should be teeing up the ball.
While I realize there is a lot to learn at this game, I am just trying to help you out with a couple of the tips that worked for me, us freakish long armed mutants need to stick together.

[Davebud]

You will get that part with practice. How far did you get it out there?

[jonjoyner83]

Originally Posted by Davebud

You will get that part with practice. How far did you get it out there?

probably 230ish

[SilverUberXeno]

3/4 inch dip is plenty to chunk a hefty piece of earth, my friend.

You should play your teed-up ball (with the driver) just inside your left heel. Based on your iron play, you have good weight shift. Don't shift more or less with the driver. This is one of the only clubs in your bag you want to use to actually hit up on the ball with. You should be leveling out at the bottom of your swing, or coming up when you contact the ball. The driver's very low loft is made for this.

As for hitting your driver 230.. you're definitely leaking power, almost to a Titanic extent. If your 3i is going 220, your driver should be comfortably at 260. Probably higher. You might be releasing a little early because it's a bigger club. Experiment a little and see what you can find. Also consider extending your arms out a bit with the driver.

[Davebud]

Originally Posted by SilverUberXeno

As for hitting your driver 230.. you're definitely leaking power, almost to a Titanic extent. If your 3i is going 220, your driver should be comfortably at 260. Probably higher. You might be releasing a little early because it's a bigger club. Experiment a little and see what you can find. Also consider extending your arms out a bit with the driver.

This is definitely true, Silver is right, you need to really straighten out your arms. This is a great advantage of being a Baboon, our longer arms give us the ability to swing lika a taller person, this increases head speed and thereby distance. OOOHH HHAAAHH HHAAAAH(baboon noises )

[SilverUberXeno]

Originally Posted by Davebud

This is definitely true, Silver is right, you need to really straighten out your arms. This is a great advantage of being a Baboon, our longer arms give us the ability to swing lika a taller person, this increases head speed and thereby distance. OOOHH HHAAAHH HHAAAAH(baboon noises )

Yesss. I knew that someday, if I read enough magazines and ate enough doritos, I'd be right!

[Davebud]

I was right all the time way back when, then I got married and haven't been right since.