Driver vs. 60* Lob Wedge

[Loop]

I use a driver and a lob wedge.
I'm much more confident with the lob wedge than any other wedge, and, besides, I get it closer with it than any other wedge. I can lob, flop, skid and stop, pitch and run with it.
So, telling that double digit players shouldn't use a lob wedge? That's your opinion, and shouldn't be the concensus.
If you always use the same club, you're bound to be better with it than any other club in your bag. That thinking also applies to the driver.

One of the reasons hackers suck with the driver is because they try to force it when they have it in their hands, while when they use a 3 wood, they'll only try to make good contact.

[Rockford35]

So, telling that double digit players shouldn't use a lob wedge? That's your opinion, and shouldn't be the concensus.

Loop,

This wasn't my goal. I just see more and more high handicappers and new golfers with a rage on for the Lob wedge when I feel that they should better focus their game elsewhere.

You make good points tho. But I still feel that beginning and lesser skilled golfers would benefit from leaving that particular club out of the bag until they gain a better understanding of their swing, course management and come to a point where they feel a 60* would both be able to focused on and benefit their particular game.

And again, I will reiterate that this is my opinion, obviously.

R35

[dave.]

There is nothing wrong with giving forthright advice,if you believe in it passionately.Imo,the lob wedge is an uneccessary club for most amateurs on most amateur course.Players kid themselves they need it,when they don't,and they kid themselves they can play it,when they can't.Some players will master it,most won't.With a modern 460 driver,more handicap players will get to grips with it than they will a lob wedge.

When Seve created all those magical shots in 1979 he did it with the equivalent of todays gap wedge,the highest loft he had,on a baked links course.

Common sense tells you the margin of error on a chip is far greater than with a lob wedge.

[Silver]

I think it really depends what you're trying to do, too. I know that I, personally, use a lob wedge for specific goals.

For instance, distance control, a full swing with a 56 gets me XXX yards and the same swing with a 60 gets me XX yards. To use a consistent swing is something I find more helpful than trying to use one club with multiple swing lengths.

Another instance is for a short, high pitch for when I need to lob over something like a bunker and I'm on a reasonably decent lie. I find it easier to get the proper loft on the 60 than I would with a 56 (that has higher bounce and is more likely to be bladed right into the bunker). Then again, the same shot from a shit lie would call for the 56 because of the bounce.

I think it's a ridiculously generalized statement to say that people either don't need it or can't play it. Need is a terrible term in golf...I don't think anyone needs anything other than a 7I and a putter, as Rock mentioned earlier. The game is just made a lot easier by having more appropriate tools. I'd rather have the 60 than have a club to fill a virtually irrelevant distance gap in between 220, 245, and 270 (3H, 3W, and driver) because the 60 actually fulfills a purpose in my bag.

[James M]

I'm a 28HCP and I really struggle with my driver, I hit one maybe two straight drives a round any they only go about 200 yards, my 60* on the other hand I'm very good with.

I'm not that good at judging distance when I'm playing a bump and run or a delicate chip shot so if I've got a nice fluffy lie I'll open the face and flop it which normally produces a good result.

I put it down to the fact that before I started playing golf I used to mess about in the garden with a wedge so now I find that shot easy, my driver however is doing my head in, so many of my shots go high and right its unbelievable and I just can't get in a groove with it.

[Pa Jayhawk]

Agreed.But remember,when pros talk about practicing the lob wedge,they have ALL DAY to practice,7 days a week if they want to.How much practice time do we have to dedicate a significant proportion of it to a difficult club to master,when in fact you may hardly ever need it and even then another club will do.?

Personally I find the LW 10 times easier to play than the driver. Granted when I hit one it is not like Mickelson, but then again, when I hit my driver it is farther from Mickelson than my LW. I guess this goes back to a Mid handicap, if they expect to master any of the clubs before they use them, they would no longer be a mid handicap and if they practiced 7 days a week they could probably play every shot from with 100 yards with 1 club if required. Half of my practice ends up being on the course simply because I do not have the time elswhere. After a couple years on the course with my LW it very well be one of my most reliable clubs for the purpose it serves. My driver at this point is certainly my least.

I think the difference is in the club design. A driver is built for forgiveness, distance and maximum swingspeed. I doubt anyone buys a 60* wedge for forgiveness or to maximize distance. It's made for precision and utility. And, if you can't get your hand eye to hit the bloody 7 iron onto the green in the first place, what's to think you can weild a weapon of accuracy like a 60* lob wedge and expect to execute?

When you hit a banana and it goes outta bounds, you're pissed off. But when you fluff a 60* wedge, the first thing you say is "I shoulda played my 8 iron there...". You don't say "I should hit the 2 iron instead of the driver on this hole."

R35

Actually I would be far more likely to better utilize my LW, this goes back to being a feel club. It is this way because they are two entirely different methods. Actually yesterday I had planned not to use my driver as much, but for the first time in about a month I hit my woods poorly, so when I got into trouble with my driver, that is exactly what I thought. Actually I had thought at that point I should have used my 4i Rescue, which is always reliable, and the only thing over a 7i that was reliable yesterday.

And this last point is the main topic on the thread. Why would someone be less likely to say that with their driver if they have no problem saying it with their LW. A stroke is a stroke is a stoke. There are far more times on the course where I say this with my driver and I do not use my driver a great deal more than my LW in most cases.

[Pa Jayhawk]

There is nothing wrong with giving forthright advice,if you believe in it passionately.Imo,the lob wedge is an uneccessary club for most amateurs on most amateur course.Players kid themselves they need it,when they don't,and they kid themselves they can play it,when they can't.Some players will master it,most won't.With a modern 460 driver,more handicap players will get to grips with it than they will a lob wedge.

When Seve created all those magical shots in 1979 he did it with the equivalent of todays gap wedge,the highest loft he had,on a baked links course.

Common sense tells you the margin of error on a chip is far greater than with a lob wedge.

Forthright advice is what this forum is about and what makes it worth while, in the same sense, if there is not proper support for a statement it may be drawn into question. I think the key is that trying to generalize ability to use certain clubs based on handicap is a mistake and classifies a xx handicap golfers as one who plays every club with as much success. Personally, if I hit every club in my bag with as much accuracy as my LW I would probably be a single digit handicap. If I hit every club with as much accuracy as my putter I would probably be a scratch golfer. If I hit every club as well as my driver I would probably be a great bowler. And if I hit my 7i the way Seve plays his 7i, I would probably only require my 7i and Putter to be ten times better than I am now.

And actually, in the cases where I tend to use a LW for Chipping and around the green, common sense tells me if I where to choose any other club I will probably end up no closer to the hole than I currently am. Trying to chip over mogels which is common in this area cannot be as affectively done with any other club unless you generate a crapload of spin. I think a LW is less risk for my ability then trying to generate that spin. An 8i would plug in the bank.

And as far as people that kid themselves about ability to play a certaing club, this is by far more common with the driver.

[Adam Pettman]

This call for a short game Duel. Lob versus Sand. The battle of the wedges.

[dave.]

FKA

I take your point,but I think its a fair generalisation to say that most higher handicappers do not have the skill to use a lob wedge consistently,and I have consistently used the word consistently

Its a high risk shot and requires skill,and again,its a fair generalisation to say that a 56 is an easier club to use.As I said earlier,practice time is hard to get,so wasting it on a 60* is beyond me,I spend most of time chipping with a 7 and a 9,and then 5 mins just flicking a 56 for the rare occasion I will need it.

[Pa Jayhawk]

I would fully agree dave., in fact one of the main reasons I started this was the guy who had a PW and a 64* trouble wedge. I personally found the 64* to be a waste of time, but do not know how he hit his. Without knowing I would think the 64* probably belongs in the shed like Rock indicated. But then again, since I don't know how he hit it even after reading his post, my advice was to get a 56* and possibly a 52* and decide from there whether he 64* really warranted a spot in his bag. I would probably give the same advice for a 60* in most cases, but would not rule it out. Personally a 64* would kill my game in the same way that a 60* may kill others, but if that is all he is used to, then it is difficult for me to make an educated guess on how it works for him. I personally only use my 64* wedge for indoor practice, and as much as I know you hate Pelz, it is one of the major flaws that I see in what he recommends in his books. So in a sense, I agree with your perspective on using anything over a 58*, but then again, I am not sure I would be nearly as effective without a 60* on the courses I play.

I will say, I would definately not recommend a 60* for everyone, that would just be foolish for all the reasons you guys stated. As I have commonly stated the affectiveness of the club is mainly mental and knowing when "NOT" to use the club.

[Pa Jayhawk]

This call for a short game Duel. Lob versus Sand. The battle of the wedges.

Personally I think if I had the game of Rock or dave. I would kick their arse by using my LW, but chances are I will never have their game and probably the reason I must rely more on my LW. I am sure I could do the same with a SW if I had the time and patience.

[longshot]

I have a 52,54,56,and a 60 which i alternate depending on the course and weather conditions on the day.My clubs dont come with a sw.I always use a 7,8 or 9 iron around the greens for chip and runs.As for the huge drivers nowdays i really dont like them that much they look so horrible at address but it makes it easier for higher handicapers to hit a good drive .
I play a vsteel 3 wood off the tee and have just bought a vsteel 2 wood which i have yet to play with.When i first started playing i had blades and persimmon woods you so soon learnt not to thin a blade on a winters morning your fingers were still viabrating on the next tee.
I have played with mid handicapers who could not hit a decent iron under a 9 if their life depended on it but were great with a 58 or 60. Theres no reason in my opinion that any handicap cannot carry a 60.I play off 5 and carry a 7 wood but it strikes the ball lovely out of the semi use what clubs you like if you can play with them.keep a diary of your last few rounds in shorthand (DLS means draw left semi )i found this system very handy for looking at after rounds for weak points in my game.You can then focus your practise on that area.

[ezra76]

I was out in my dad's backyard this afternoon. LW, SW and a plastic 3 gallon flower pot from 40yds. SW tough to hit due to bounce and fluffy grass and soft ground. LW hit the bucket 3 times out of 20, 75% within 3-6ft. and only chunked one. I have trouble when I half-ass my LW swing. It's all or nothing with this club for me. Driver, hit 11/12 fairways I hit driver on last round. I have been hitting 10-15 yd. fades very consistantly. I was able to hit 1 straight as an arrow and put a little 5 yd. low draw on another when I needed to.