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Bad Fan Behavior

Discussion in 'General Golf Talk' started by TheTrueReview, Feb 26, 2018.

  1. eclark53520

    eclark53520 DB Member Extraordinaire Supporting Member

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    DTP and DC typically only apply to verbal situations when the perpetrator is likely to incite violence. Yelling 'mashed potatoes' is not likely to incite violence and is not a call to action (like yelling fire in a public place). So I think you would have a very difficult time prosecuting for either DTP or DC in this situation. Unless you're able to get the local government to write specific verbiage into the statute stating that during a golf tournament, loud verbal outbursts are specifically deemed DTP/DC of course.
     
  2. MCDavis

    MCDavis The Plaid Duffer Staff Member Moderator

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    Given how much $$ is brought to the area for the tournament, I'm betting this could be done. These guys are literally disturbing the peace, and I'm betting a decent percentage are drunk enough to be drunk and disorderly.

    It's a matter of interpretation.
     
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  3. eclark53520

    eclark53520 DB Member Extraordinaire Supporting Member

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    I feel like if it was this easy, it would have been done already. We can't be the first people to think of this.
     
  4. MCDavis

    MCDavis The Plaid Duffer Staff Member Moderator

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    Few are they that are as smart as the ShotTalk Brain Trust.
     
  5. TEA Time

    TEA Time Grumpy Gilmore Staff Member Admin

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    Mandatory shock collars for everyone who buys a beer. Problem solved.
     
  6. eclark53520

    eclark53520 DB Member Extraordinaire Supporting Member

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    This, would be hilarious.
     
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  7. azgreg

    azgreg "Don't count that." Supporting Member

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    [​IMG]
     
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  8. limpalong

    limpalong Mental Ward Escapee Supporting Member

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    Local law enforcement has no jurisdiction on private property unless a crime is being committed. As Lark said, shouting in someone's backswing is not against any public law that I know of. If I were to be arrested by law enforcement for saying something that disturbed a professional golfer at a tournament, I'd own some of that property before it was over.
    If, locally, I saw our police department working a golf tournament while on the taxpayers clock I would be sitting in the Chief's office tomorrow. We have two big "drunk fests" in our area. One is a Faux Patty's Day in a bar district close to the university campus. That is on public streets and does incur significant extra costs for law enforcement. We've had drunks wandering into homes, passing out in back yards, etc. Now have evolved to fencing a large 4-block area and trying to contain the vomit and feces inside that area. Volunteers from the community perform cleanup duties. The other is a large country western concert that draws people from hundreds of miles away. Happens the last weekend in June each year. It's on public land, but out by the lake. Over the years we've had people stabbed, strangled, beat to a pulp, and almost die from alcohol poisoning. Local law enforcement does police the area but are paid by the organization that puts on the concert each year. I believe this past year the arrests were kept under 100. Some years it's been higher.
    Those are instances where law enforcement is required to keep folks from getting killed, maimed, etc. Again, it's far different than yelling "Get in the hole" as someone tees off on a 500 yard hole.
     
  9. PaPaD

    PaPaD Club ho, geezer........ Supporting Member

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    Ya just can't fix stupid and alcohol makes them more stupider(er)...........
     
  10. TheTrueReview

    TheTrueReview "Playing it straight" Supporting Member

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    Surely, there’s an offense of “disorderly behavior”(howsoever described). Traditionally it’s a context offense. Actions which may not be disorderly at a rock concert may be disorderly for example at a public Xmas Carroll event.

    Some idiot shouting random, stupid words in the middle of a tight packed group of spectators surely comes within disorderly conduct. I get that yelling "mashed potato" at a Guns and Roses Concert wouldn't get you kicked out but I think it's a different situation when shouting it at players when teeing off at a golfing tourney.

    To be frank, I’m surprised more of them aren’t given a knuckle sandwich. Having some clown standing next to me shouting “mashed potato” in my ear would sorely test my patience.
     
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2018
  11. subsonic

    subsonic Well-Known Member Supporting Member

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    Limp- Not to be a Sea Lawyer...

    1) The Cops are paid to be there. Guarantee it is an off duty detail. No need to go the Chief.

    2) If they are being paid to enforce a certain standard of conduct they will since you are the property owner.. Ex: No shouting or lewd remarks at players or you will be removed. That is what they will do if you violate the standard.
     
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  12. eclark53520

    eclark53520 DB Member Extraordinaire Supporting Member

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    Yes, but they still can't arrest people for doing things that aren't illegal. They can remove them from the property, and if they refuse or resist they can be charged with trespass or whatever other actual law they break.

    I can't have a private party on private property, pay for police officer presence, and tell them to arrest and charge anyone with a blue hat for disorderly conduct. Even if I state before the party to all invitees that they are not allowed to wear a blue hat. It's not illegal to wear a blue hat. I can have the police ask them to leave if they're wearing a blue hat, that's well within my rights as a property owner. What the blue hat person does when they're asked to leave decides whether or not they will be arrested.

    Yelling a word that does not incite violence nor is a call to action is NOT disorderly conduct unless the local municipality has a very atypical wording for their DC statute.
     
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  13. PaPaD

    PaPaD Club ho, geezer........ Supporting Member

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    Shock collars could fix the blue hat problem too....................
     
  14. subsonic

    subsonic Well-Known Member Supporting Member

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    Good thoughts... But you are looking at it wrong. Good attempt at Sea Lawyering. 1 Gold Star awarded for trying.

    They are arrested for trespassing. The property owner wants them removed due to their conduct. Failure to leave is where the law is broken. At that point, they are trespassing,
     
  15. limpalong

    limpalong Mental Ward Escapee Supporting Member

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    Patrick Reed playing in a European Tour event. Camera crew jingle change in their pocket each time he gets read to hit. Finally, he has them removed. Camera crew, allegedly, was attempting to distract a specific player. IMHO, removal justified.

    Xander Schauffele has potential of winning The Open Championship. As he is trying to hit a delicate chip, a toddler keeps crying/screaming right next to him. No intent. Just a parent unwilling to silence kid or move herself and kid away from the immediate area of the play. Should she be removed? Not intentional. IMHO, she should have been asked to remove herself and the kid from the area and if she refused, then removed.

    Anonymous fans in a crowd shout things like "Mashed potato", "Get in the hole", etc. at inopportune times. Were those shouts specifically timed to disrupt a specific player? Or, was the timing simply chance? If the shout was emitted 30 seconds earlier... or later... would anyone have noticed? Should every person that shouts something... "Nice shot!", "Bad break", etc. be removed? Are we to expect the decorum of a public library?
    Many times a player is getting ready to make a shot when the gallery on a nearby hole erupts in applause and shouting. That is disruptive. Should everyone in that gallery be removed?

    I can understand hired security asking a noticeably intoxicated and/or belligerent person to leave the premises. If that person or persons refuses to leave, it's trespassing and the local law enforcement has justifiable cause to intervene. If a person shouts something at an bad time, is able to be identified by security personnel, is warned and is apologetic should they be removed?

    Seems to me execution of some vague "no noise" policy would become extremely subjective depending on the player, the security person, and the alleged violator.
     
  16. PaPaD

    PaPaD Club ho, geezer........ Supporting Member

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    At the events I have attended, this is managed pretty well.
     
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  17. TheTrueReview

    TheTrueReview "Playing it straight" Supporting Member

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  18. eclark53520

    eclark53520 DB Member Extraordinaire Supporting Member

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    Yup, I agree with you. Not sure how I'm looking at it wrong tho...
     
  19. TEA Time

    TEA Time Grumpy Gilmore Staff Member Admin

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    Who tf brings a toddler to a golf tournament? Especially a major!
     
  20. subsonic

    subsonic Well-Known Member Supporting Member

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    I thought you were talking about the conduct. I did not take enough time to thoroughly read your post. If a post is more than 30 words, I skim at best. I apologize for my error. That is why I have no idea what Limpy is talking about most of the time.
     
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