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De-lofting iron set

Discussion in 'Golf Equipment Talk' started by JArmour, Dec 1, 2008.

  1. JArmour

    JArmour Go VOLS!

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    This is a story one of my regular playing partners told me today. He said a golf pro at a course around our house said that if he de-lofts his irons a few degrees it will lower his ball flight.

    My questions are, is this change worth it and what else would it effect? Also I thought that different shafts are they way people usually change ball flight in irons?

    Thanks
  2. BigJim13

    BigJim13 Well-Known Member Staff Member

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    There was a thread about this awhile back. If you do a search about bending irons (adding loft maybe) you may be able to find it. I know that decreasing loft would change the bounce, can't remember how though. I imagine that the flight would lower depending on how much you deloft them-think 7i vs 6i and which flies higher.
  3. Youngun5

    Youngun5 Beware of the Phog!

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    I'm pretty sure that delofting your irons will decrease the bounce on a 1:1 ratio. (deloft 1*, you loose 1* in bounce)

    you also increase the offset by doing this.
  4. indacup

    indacup Well-Known Member Supporting Member

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    Too many open issues here...But lets start with the most obvious:

    Why does your buddy wanna lower the ball flight?
  5. JEFF4i

    JEFF4i She lives! Supporting Member

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    I've never really understood this when you are looking for a different ball flight. With the options of a swing change, or club change, available, why not just use those?
  6. JArmour

    JArmour Go VOLS!

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    I really have no idea. He is sure he is losing distance by hitting his irons too high. He said he was hitting balls at a course and the pro was talking to him and this came up. Now he has his mizzy's scheduled to be sent back to the factory to have them changed.

    I told him to hold off and I'd ask some of you guys. I told him what I thought, maybe change shafts or something along those lines.
  7. BigJim13

    BigJim13 Well-Known Member Staff Member

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    Hitting the ball high doesn't necessarily mean he is losing distance. I love to be able to hit nice towering high fades with all my clubs, its so reliable for me its crazy. That being said if he is ballooning shots then he could be losing distance and that to me would mean either shaft issue or swing issue, not sure which coudl be both. I don't think he will get the results he is looking for by delofting-I mean clubs today are pretty delofted as it is. I mean my PW is 46*, that used to be a 9i or even an 8i in some sets.
  8. Wi-Golfer

    Wi-Golfer Golfer on hiatus. Supporting Member

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    I don't understand the need to desire to deloft irons. Did the pro's from years gone by go thru all this mess or did they just adapt & play with what they had?
  9. David Hillman

    David Hillman Well-Known Member

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    What's the lowest iron in his bag now? A 3? A 4? Can he hit? If not, all he's going to do is take one club out of his bag. His 9 will become an 8, etc, and his 4 or 5 will become useless.

    I don't see the point. Tell him to save his money and overclub.
  10. SilverUberXeno

    SilverUberXeno El Tigre Blanco

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    I'll throw some things out there.

    You know a 4 iron is a 5 iron that is slightly longer and delofted? And a 5 is a 6 that is longer and delofted?

    Okay... so if you deloft your whole set, your 4 becomes a 3, and your 3 becomes a 2. Do you think your friend can hit a 2 iron successfully? Keep in mind, his 3 is probably ALREADY a 2 of earlier years.

    Hitting the ball high DOES lose distance. That's why you don't hit your 9 as far as you hit your 4. But do you WANT to hit your 9 as far as you hit your 4? Nope.

    It is MUCH easier to lower a ball-flight by changing loft, versus changing shafts. ESPECIALLY in the case of irons, which can be bent, as opposed to drivers, where a new head is needed.

    Remind your friend that Par is a measure of how many strokes it takes you to get in the hole, not a picture drawn of how you did it. If you can only hit your 7 iron 90 yards, but you make par on every hole, you're a great golfer.

    If he's genuinely BALLOONING shots, meaning they rise like an exponential curve, he certainly needs to adjust something, but that "something" is very likely his swing.

    A SWING flaw can offset every compensatory alteration in your equipment in a fraction of a second.

    But for knowledge's sake...

    Every 1* you deloft an iron also lowers bounce by 1*. The bounce on those clubs is probably less than 3, so I would NOT recommend delofting them at all. Offset also increases marginally, encouraging the ball to the left.
  11. Bignose

    Bignose Well-Known Member

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    This is exactly what I was thinking. If he really wants to spend some money, have the 7 ground off the bottom of the club and have someone engrave an 8 into it. That way his "8 iron" goes 10 yards farther -- and it'll have a lower trajectory to boot!

    Heck, why not go balls to the wall and have something like a 13 engraved on it? "Yeah, you wussies were hitting 6 and 7 irons onto that par 3, but I hit my 11 iron, because I am such a stud!"

    Irons are for accuracy. Period. Besides stroking the ego, what does it matter if he's hitting a 4 iron, a 6 iron, an 8 iron, or a PW into a green from a given distance? All that matters is how accurately and consistently he hits them. If you hit your 6 iron 100 yards each and every time, so what if the other guys are hitting their PW from 100 out?

    I always think that people who start going crazy with these things don't really get that golf is wholly and completely only a game of how many strokes. That there is no place on the score card to write what club you hit when, what your swing looks like, or how pretty your shot was -- there are no style points in golf. It is only about how many strokes to get the ball in the hole.
  12. Youngun5

    Youngun5 Beware of the Phog!

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    i agree to a point....irons are all about accuracy, but...

    if I had the capability to hit a PW 150 yards, instead of say, a 5i, i'm taking pw every time. if you and I are equally skilled golfers, physics tells me I'm going to be able to hit the shorter club with much more consistency/accuracy than you are the longer club.

    plus there are times like front pin positions/tucked pins, its nice to have the ability to hit it higher/stop it closer to where it originally lands.
  13. RickinMA

    RickinMA Well-Known Member Supporting Member

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    as others have said, decreasing loft also decreases the bounce angle of the sole. If your friend hits down on his irons and takes a divot, there's a good chance the bounce angle of his clubs are helping him. Clubs with 0 or negative bounce angles aren't very playable for the majority of golfers.
    From XXX yards, I'd rather hit a cavity back PW at 48* with 6* sole angle, than a blade style 52* wedge that has been bent to 48* with 2* of bounce. I also wouldn't want to try to hit a 3 iron that is really a 2i.
  14. JArmour

    JArmour Go VOLS!

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    Right, I agree with everyone here. I just want the info to come from the masses and not just me. I don't have any extensive club building knowledge but, I told him I'd ask around for him. Im going to tell him to log on here tomorrow to check the threads and chime in. I don't think he hits the ball too high, I think he's getting older and doesn't have the club head speed to hit the ball as far as he used to. He's using the ball flight as an excuse.

    Anyway thanks for all of the responses.
  15. West Coast Duffer

    West Coast Duffer Orange County California

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    If he wants hotter clubs he can buy some Cobra S9s or someTaylor Mades.
  16. BigJim13

    BigJim13 Well-Known Member Staff Member

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    I see what you're saying but if you deloft your PW to the loft of a 7i say, are you still hitting a PW? Would you still be as accurate with that PW just because it says PW on the bottom?
  17. Pa Jayhawk

    Pa Jayhawk Well-Known Member

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    This whole concept sounds like the guy needs to get over the number on the bottom of the club. If he wants to lower his ball flight to gain distance, take a club more. If he goes from a PW to a 9i he will lower his ball flight. De lofting the club to do this sounds like a huge mistake that will come at the expense of consistency.

    If he decides this is a necessity, I would recommend he take them to a quality clubmaker to have this straightened out, and not simply send them back to Mizuno. He will get the whole just of what he wants and how it will affect his game, and he will likely spend less having it done than what it will cost in shipping. Probably $5-10 a club. He will also have them back that day.

    Did he ever have the lofts (and lies) checked from factory when he got the fitted clubs? Good example. My Mizuno PW played about the same as my 52* GW, and much shorter than my 9i. Probably had something to do with the fact my 47* PW was 49* and my 52* GW played close to 50*.

    Don't just trust they sent them with the correct loft. The guy I took mine to said that his experience with Mizuno's are that they usually come with the correctly lie but incorrect lofts. He probably needs to do what he should have done the day he got the clubs and have them checked. Then if he still needs a lower ball flight and longer distance because he can't disassociate the number on the bottom of the club, then they could bend them and let him know how he will be effected. He may want to find the specs to take in from when he was fitted so they know what the lie should be.

    For example, when I had mine bent, I went the other way. How far I hit my 8i, 9i and PW means nothing to me as long as they have the correct distance gap. I know from past experience that having more offset on my irons is the reason I went from my Pings to my Mizunos, and the offset on the Pings derailed my game. Had I wanted to say I hit each club further, I would have been adding offset and likely would have ended up hating my irons for that reason. I would rather hit my 8i 4 yards less than hit my PW 4 yards more and lower with the added offset. To me the whole thing that attracted me to Mizuno's were the less offset. He may want to go swing a club with more offset and see if he can live with the results. Even if he can, he may not be able to later as I learned on my last set of clubs. That and the fact that he will be taking away the bounce as mentioned earlier. Will he still be able to strike the ball as well, who knows??? My Mizuno's also started out with less bounce than many of the others I looked at and am not sure I would like less.

    Here is the thread from when I recently did this, that may give some of the info you may need.
    http://www.shottalk.com/forum/equipment-talk/22857-bending-irons-4-5-gaps.html

    Again, this all sounds like he just needs to get over the number on the bottom of the club. Assuming he gets consistent distance gaps that he wants, who cares if he is hitting a PW or even an 8i. Look at it this way, I now hit more greens with my 9i than most of the people I know, probably because it plays closer to their PW. :laugh: I play with a guy that delofts his clubs and hits his 8i probably as far or further than I hit my 5i. He doesn't hit any more greens with his 8i than I do with my 5i (possibly less), and he rarely tee's off with great consistency on anything over around a 20* hybrid, which he hits about the same as I hit my driver. He also does have a ton more speed and can hit the crap out of the ball but I really think because of his technique he has limited his game to where the added speed and distance does not really benefit him because it comes with too much lack of control.
  18. Pa Jayhawk

    Pa Jayhawk Well-Known Member

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  19. JArmour

    JArmour Go VOLS!

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    Thanks for the post PA. I just copy and pasted every reply and sent it to him in an email. Hopefully he takes your advice.
  20. LyleG

    LyleG gear head

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    PA is dead on the money. Clubs shouldnt even have numbers on them , just lofts.

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