Irons too long...

[Nikonut]

am feeling victimized..

last year, I had lessons from 2 pros, at different place.
the first set of lessons, no mention was made about the length of my standard issue Irons.

The 2nd pro, whom I visited with and had about 3 lessons, well on the first day, first 5 minutes, told me I need 1-1/2 to 1-3/4 longer irons.
thats a LOT.

Went to the local clubmaker. Cant say he really agreed, but he did not overly voise disagreement. he extended and regripped and lie adjusted all my irons. that was a fair chunk of change.

fast forward to today. I went for a tune-up (big tuneup it turns out).
New person, PGA Instructor type, etc.
He says my Irons are way to long - after fixing my posture , butt more out, less knee flex, for what that is worth.

Plus I have _never_ seen a chart calling for such an added lenght.
wrists are 37" height 6'4" in sneakers. even with +/- 1/2 inch in wrist, the irons are at most 1/2" over.

I dont know, I just had to post this here in the ask the pro....
how many of us get get bad advice, and no one making the $$ cares to say , no you dont need to spend money....


Oh yeah and somthing else that really made me mad...

a week or so ago
I was talking to that 2nd pro - the long club pro - he asked how I was doing.

I responded, and he had me hold a club, etc.

He then GOES TO A PING CHART and say you MIGHT NEED 1/2 OVER.

dammmmiiitttt. thanks for remembering the "advice" you gave me last year..

any and all comments or simliar stories are very much welcomed!

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[N.V.M.]

here's my philosophy on things. just because a person has a degree, diploma, or any kind of certificate, it does not mean they are good at what they do. this goes for doctors, engineers, golf instructors, whatever.

 

[slickpitt]

I think I would be a little irked as well. 1.5 to 1.75 longer just seems huge to me. Even for a tall person such as yourself. Almost sounds like that pro has a glass navel.

 

[SilverUberXeno]

You should've brought up that previous incident and said, "But last year you told me..."

Seriously.

 

[mont86]

I'm not a pro, but one and half to one three quarter is alot!

from what I've learned 1/2 to 3/4 is about average unless your a giant.

 

[Nikonut]

You should've brought up that previous incident and said, "But last year you told me..."

Seriously.

I wanted too, I was shocked.. I should have spoke and, and esp mentioned how much it cost me.. that was 9 clubs it was near $200.

I could buy a set now off ebay etc for less that that. heck the only irons from the hogan set I use now are 6,7,8,9,E,S
since I has always questioned it, my other wedges I have extended 1". not so bad, and can be choked down.

Sometimes I would think about my Irons, and how they were "frankensteined"... kinda depressing, but even still I could hit them well enough.

and with todays lesson in Posture, I choked down on the 6 and 7 irons and still hit them pretty good.

BTW, the lesson and posture change did have me hitting the Adams A4 driver a LOT straighter, quite simply in fact without any out of the ordinary stuff. Before, all I could do with it, was slice.

As far as the clubmaker, I kind of feel like this:
a 34 index "player" is not that important, just do "whatever" to sell something.

I suppose that whether I fix the current Irons or get another used set, then I am "done", and wont mess with them again. I must admit I feel get the clubmaker (who is a fitter too) to readjust for free except grips, I guess, since they wear out anyway.

would you guys ask for the free labor as a remedy ?? I would first have to get him to admit that he should not have gone along with the lenght change.

 

[SilverUberXeno]

I think you should bring it up very politely. Maybe there is some explanation, you know? Don't go in there DEMANDING anything. You have no real right to, unfortunately. He suggested and you followed. But you should explain the situation and ask him why there's the discrepancy, and ask him if there's anything he can do to help you get them where they should be NOW.

That's the key- ask him to help you make them right.

 

[sidewinder]

Stewart Cink is 6' 4" tall and plays standard length irons. I am 6' 3" and I play +.5" irons. I can't imagine anyone but a 7' tall player needing 1" or more extra length.

S-

 

[wirehair]

If you want them shortened, pull the plugs from them. Go by Golfsmith, grab some grips (you could order online for a discount, but after shipping they'd be about the same), then call me, it's an easy fix.

 

[riverc0il]

Iron length involves WTF more than height. I read somewhere about a club fitter that had to actually fit a big professional basketball player with shorter than standard irons because his arms were so long. Most online charts say 37" WTF is about 1/2" longer than standard give or take depending on your height. Depending on how your swing attacks the ball, the extension may or may not be necessary.

Unfortunately, you may be stuck. The club maker did not agree with the assessment but he did what he was told to do even though he mentioned that may not be best. If the pro that told you 1.5 to 1.75 longer is honorable, I hope that he/she might offer free lessons to compensate for your having to repair your clubs or purchase new ones. I think this is ultimately a situation of buyer beware. I plan to upgrade my beginner set soon and I have spent almost a full year investigating the crazy world of club building. Having done my research, if any pro suggested I got with any more than a half inch longer club, I would stop the lesson and request my money back for the lesson let alone make the fitting adjustment.

 

[Nikonut]

true all around!

Indeed, I wont (and usually dont ) make demands. But I will be straight up and let them know that as a clubfitter, I want the reccomendation.

The Pro who suggested the length, was also having me play a baseball grip, and a tilted stance. With straight drives, from a straighter stance.....I wont be going back to him for anything.

hi, Wirehair, I have tried doing grips, and though it should be easy.... maybe I should have used masking tape or at least a different tape, as several grips would not go all the way.

In any event , I will need the lie checked and tweaked, so the miminal charge for cutting the extensions to 1/2" and regripping wont be too bad. I probably wont go for the more expensive grips.

appreciate the feedback on this subject!

 

[Pa Jayhawk]

The Pro who suggested the length,

As far as the clubmaker, I kind of feel like this:
a 34 index "player" is not that important, just do "whatever" to sell something.

I suppose that whether I fix the current Irons or get another used set, then I am "done", and wont mess with them again. I must admit I feel get the clubmaker (who is a fitter too) to readjust for free except grips, I guess, since they wear out anyway.

would you guys ask for the free labor as a remedy ?? I would first have to get him to admit that he should not have gone along with the lenght change.

I would find someone you know to be a qualified clubmaker, and when you take the clubs to them, make sure to ask what they recommend, and not tell them what you need. The only time I have ever done such, was for grips, that is only through trial and error and because the grip is as much about feel, and I do those myself now. While I do my own grips now, I still have my wife take hers to our clubmaker, as he is more qualified to address any questions she may have. It is worth the price to know that she is confident in the work. I would be no more likely to have something done to my clubs on the advice of a pro teaching me lessons than I would to get advice on my swing from a clubmaker. Unless in either instance, I see evidence that they are qualified to do both. If the pro was just as qualified to do both, then I would have to ask why he didn't do the work for you. Not that I would have likely let him touch my clubs without prior recommendation of his work from someone I trusted. I would take it with a grain of salt and go to the other and simply ask if they see evidence that I need a change, and not even tell them what I think the change needs to be done. Also, when the clubmaker adjusted the lies, did he ask or check that the current lies were proper for you, or simply adjust them base on the length adjustment?

To me, it sounds like the big issue here is probably the Clubmaker. Not that I would likely trust the pros that told me to have it done either, or go back to them either. You are paying them to fix your swing, and if they thought work needed to be done on your clubs, I think just letting you know it may be benificial to go to a clubmaker to get their feedback, would have been enough. If I were to go to the guy that I use, he would not even do the work for me unless he was certain it needed to be done. If he were not confident it was in the right direction, he would actually talk me out of having it done unless I was to stubborn or stupid to listen. In which case, he would then likely just show me the door.

As far as being a 34 index, any clubmaker worth going to would likely realize that it is probably more important for a 34 index to have properly fitted clubs, than someone with far more ability who could likley more easily adapt to improperly fitted clubs. Not that it is not a necessity for both.

Here is a list of clubmakers that may be a good starting point, while I couldn't vouch for all of them, I would say that you are far more likely to get a good one than just picking one out of a phonebook. I do know one in North Jersey (Denville) that I can vouch for, and will drive an hour each way to have him do the work for me. I would also ask around, find one you can trust, stick with them. Above all, ask them what needs to be done, and don't tell them, and talk with them. I would say the majority of the good ones are not making money hand over fist and are doing it because the love their work. The money they are making is likely all coming from referral work from people who are pleased with their work. They will not get that work if they are just trying to get your money and show you the door. While in many cases (not all), you will likely pay more to have it done by a qualified clubmaker because they have different price points and make a living on quality of work and not bulk sales, but you will be assured it is done right and will avoid having issues such as this. They also need to make up for the sales they lose by telling you when you don't need to have any work done.
Tom Wishon Golf Technology

 

[xamilo]

I think you should bring it up very politely. Maybe there is some explanation, you know? Don't go in there DEMANDING anything. You have no real right to, unfortunately. He suggested and you followed. But you should explain the situation and ask him why there's the discrepancy, and ask him if there's anything he can do to help you get them where they should be NOW.

That's the key- ask him to help you make them right.

+1. Its incredible to find such discrepancy in a same person's thoughts about your clubs. I would bring it up as well, since you spent some money followign his advice, only to change back again...

 

[Nikonut]

good post jayhawk

and also just to be clear:

it was the instructor who said to make them looonng. and the same Instructor who later looked at a Ping chart... not the club making man.

heres the deal,
I went to the club guy...btw he had done work for a few pga tour pros and a lot of other amatuer and almost tour classed pros. His shop is always busy.

anyway, he agreed that the Pros advice was NOT what he would have done for me.

Here though, we have a situation where a well know club guy - who knows everyone, and everyone knows him..

I can understand how he will take my verbal directions, via a 3rd party, though his own opinion is different. He did not know me from adam when I walked in..
I have never heard him use the "put down others" method of obtaining work, and I have have traded with him a half dozen times. (club ho'ing)

Rather, today he mentioned 2 names who he thought were very good instructors, and indeed, one of them was who helped me yesterday.

So the clubs are getting fixed. they will be 3/4 over. He said he preffered the extra 1/4 over the typical 1/2, this gives me room - to not be just under the best fit.

from this point on, I can attack practice and play, feeling that I have reasonable equipment setup.

 

[Pa Jayhawk]

He does not need to "Know you from Adam" to properly fit you for clubs if he is willing to take the time to do so. That is what he should b trained to do. The fact that he fit you according to specs that he did not personally agree with simply tells me that he is someone I would never deal with. I simply cannot understand how he would take 3rd party advice over his own, if he considers himself a professional. That is completely unacceptable, and his only excuse for doing so in admitting that he is not capable to do the work or did not have the time to help you because he would rather make money with no questions as to whether it is the correct decision. I certainly wouldn't take his advice of what pro to go see, as that pro likely just has the same unprofessional money making mentality as he. Specifically, in that you indicated he knew you were a 36 index and are having someone else do the work, which should tell him you probably aren't the person he should be listening to on how he should do his work. Has nothing to do with putting down others, if the others are more capable than he, they should have been able to do the work. It is a matter of taking pride in your work, and assuring it is done correctly.

Would seem kinda like going to a surgeon and saying that your dentist indicated you needed to have your spleen removed, and the surgeon simply saying "O.K., it will cost you this much", for the sake of not questioning the judgment of your dentist. He has a responsibility to the patient, to make sure it is necessary. If he is not capable of doing such, he belongs in another profession.