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Question ablut Precept Laddie Xtreme Balls?

Discussion in 'Golf Equipment Talk' started by golflover, Nov 28, 2006.

  1. Pa Jayhawk

    Pa Jayhawk Well-Known Member

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    I agree with this in large part, most of what I posted on the importance of compression rating has more to do if you find yourself at the extremes, and why I concentrated more on ball construction. If you have a slow swing, a Pro V1x will likely hurt you simply based on compression. If you have a tour calibur swing, and Noodle or Laddie will likely do the same and not give you an optimal effect. If you just have the swing of most in between, then you likely will not see the same adverse result, or I should say, lessoning your performance potential. I think it is more important understanding the characteristics of the different type of balls. Why they spin, where they obtain distance, why the feel the way the do, and fitting youself based on the characteristics you wish to obtain. So a 3 piece ball may not be optimal for many and may be a waste of money. However, if you have a decent swing, and want a ball that feels good, gives optimal distance as well as decent spin, it is likely you are not going to find all of these in most 2 piece ball, you are likely going to sacrifice one area for another. Even with a speed of 103-105, I have seen some pretty strange ball flights of my driver with balls designed to compress easily, mainly the Noodle and the Precepts, and am convinced it is because of the compression. Kind of a Knuckleball effect. The ball otherwise played great for me, although I never quit got over the fact that I was likely losing something with that ball as far as distance based on what I saw.

    Also I have always been and Maxfli fan, and like the suggestion of the Black Max. Although I am not sure if the $25-30 price range is to high. I also like the Maxfli Rev Tour, which can sometimes be found in the $12-15 range, which is what the Black Max replaced. These are 2 balls I have played for under $30 that IMO closely knit with the Pro V1 characteristics. Although I no longer have a problem switch golf balls on a whim. A few years back I played the Wilson Smart Core Pro Distance, I played it for about 3 years. It was fairly long off the tee, felt nice around the greens, which was unusual for a distance ball, and likely had more spin than most distance balls I have played. It was discontinued 2 balls prior to the True, although can still easily be found for around $19 for 2 dozen. Just my opinion, but after that I tried the Iwound and then the True. The Iwound is probably one of the worst balls I have played, and I prefered the Smart Core over the True. May be worth a shot if you don't require a ball that spins a great deal.

    edit 1 - Also, this goes back to if it works for your, then great. I use the Check-Go ball spinner, it works for me, puts a nice line around my ball, and the validity of the device was already debated in here with great detail. I can tell you from experience that I would question the whole premise behind the True. The ones that I tried on the Check-GO do have a balance point. For the claims to be valid, it would spin differently each time, they do not. I actual wonder if this is not the reason the ball was discontinued and is harder to find than even the Smart Core or the Iwound.
     
  2. limpalong

    limpalong Mental Ward Escapee Supporting Member

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    Definitely not a negative slant on the Volvik balls. Love the color combo's... love the feel... But... I do believe my experience with that particular ball highlights the theory of matching ball desin to clubhead speed. You see, the inconsistency isn't between balls... it's with the same ball! That tells me the core design allows the ball to react differently... inconsistenly... with my specific iron speed. It seems that those with lower swing speeds have a much better consistency factor with that ball. The core "reaction" is designed for slower swing speeds. Very similar as to some folks with a relatively slow swing speed having difficulty getting consistency out of a ProV1x. The core of the "x" is designed to react more consistently with the higher swing speeds.

    This entire ball science has become almost unmanageable. Used to be the ranges at PGA events were equipped with Titleist balls only! Now and then, you would find an event that would furnish a few Maxfli's at the range for those players. Today... the PGA events must have ProV1's, ProV1x's, Callaway Tour, Callaway Tour 56, Bridgestone's, the new Taylor Made balls... There are a bazillion different balls just being played in a single event. And, the feel and reaction to each differs dramatically when you have the feel that it takes to play at that level.

    Some years ago... mid 90's... Top Flite brought out a "T" ball and a "C" ball. The "T" ball was 'designed' to play better off a Taylor Made driver and the "C" ball was 'designed' for use with Callaway equipment. The idea busted!!! Those that played to a level that they could actually tell the difference weren't playing Top Rocks anyway!!! With the ball technology of today, even the beginners can usually feel a difference between a Laddie and a Top Flite distance ball. Will one make a difference over the other re scoring at the beginner level?? Heck, NO! I don't care at what level we play, until we can place a spot somewhere near the center of the clubface on the back of the ball... The first secret is good contact! Once you master a repeating, consistent swing... then you can get wrapped up in ball science. Until then, we hackers just enjoy the OCD fun of over analysis of most everything with this game!!!
     
  3. Pa Jayhawk

    Pa Jayhawk Well-Known Member

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    I also have to draw question to this, it seems like who wrote this is trying to put their own interpretation on the meaning of the word compression.

    "Compression - Ball compression used to be one of the most important specifications to choose a golf ball. The compression rating, 80, 90 or 100 (even 110 was approved), denotes the hardness of core. The lower the compression, the softer a golf ball feel at impact. "

    They give the definition, but then it seems like they put their own spin on it afterwards. Simply because it has to do with the density or softness of the core, doesn't mean the intent of the rating is how soft the ball feels at impact. Granted, they may have a relation but this seems to be ignore the meaning and characteristist of the benifit of compression. I don't view it as a gauge of how soft a ball feels, but a gauge of the how the ball "Compresses". Again, this is more physics. A five year old hits a super ball with a baseball bat, it will likely go further than a same sized golf ball because of the compression and how he swings the bat. Barry Bonds or Mark McGuire hits a Super ball with a baseball bat, if it stays in one piece I doubt I would say there is an advantage to the superball over a golf ball.

    I may be wrong, but I don't think the intent of how compression rating relates to golf has to do with how soft the ball feels at impact. Granted it may in fact be related, but if that were the intent I think it would likely be a "Softness" rating, and not a "Compression" rating.

    Again though, I may be wrong, not completely sure.
     
  4. MCDavis

    MCDavis The Plaid Duffer Staff Member Moderator

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    Yep, they're Laddie Extremes. Found 1 box on the shelf and had to use a price checker to get the price.

    Giving them as gifts for Christmas.
     
  5. golflover

    golflover Well-Known Member

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    I have hard a lot of people say how they use hard balls and say they like their compression to be around 110. I guess everyone is not knowing what compression is?

    Also when I googled "golf ball compression" many say compression has to do with softness.

    Many manufacturers are not even telling us what the compression is on their packaging.

    Quite a confusing subject. That is why I think that compression doesn't really matter just go with what feels right for you both on and off the green.
     
  6. Pa Jayhawk

    Pa Jayhawk Well-Known Member

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    I guess it is all a matter of interpretation. Do the same search with "golf ball compression" including the quotation marks. The top link will show you how they do the testing. Then form your own impressions. I base most of my opinion on how they did the testing, and what it means to my particular game.


    " Golf Ball Compression

    As golf balls are mass produced, all 3-piece balls and some 2-piece balls are measured by their compression and rated accordingly. In order to do so balls are pressured with a standard weight.

    A ball which does not deform is rated Compression 200, a ball which lets itself be deformed by 0.2" or more is rated Compression 0. In-between these two extremes compression increases or decreases with every 0.001" of inch of deformation. Standard Compression rate of a golf ball is 90 or 100. The lower the Compression rate the softer the feel. Most balls are subject to a rating by compression. There are also compression rates of 80 and 110.

    Unfortunately there is no official standard which manufacturers adhere to. Therefore a compression rate 90 of manufacturer A is not necessarily the same as compression rate 90 of manufacturer B. Furthermore not every ball has the imprinted compression rate either. The difference can easily amount up to 3.5 points in either direction.

    Surveys have shown that low speed swing players should use a ball with a Compression rate of 80. Average speed swing players should use Compression 100 and high speed swing players Compression 110.

    Also the influence compression can have in different types of weather is not to be underestimated. According to American surveys high compression balls show better performance in warm weather whereas low compression balls are more suitable for colder weather."
    from here.
    http://www.golfjoy.com/golf_physics/characters.asp

    This really makes it more of a science, and what you want to read into the definition?????

    Basically you are sticking a ball on a device that applies pressure to show how it compresses. It is anyones guess how you interpret this. Personally I don't think the device knows how the ball feels, but on my iterpretation it does give me an idea how it will perform given a certain golf swing. Again, just how you interpret the findings.

    That is probably the down side to the internet, you will likely get 20 contradictory opinions on what something means, I guess it comes down to which you want to based your opinion base on what you already know.
     
  7. limpalong

    limpalong Mental Ward Escapee Supporting Member

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    This is the down side of this industry. You WILL get at leat 20 contradictory opinions on what something means. What it comes down to is that I'M ALWAYS correct!!!! Just ask my wife! LOL

    If everything in this industry were black & white, we wouldn't have near as many of these discussion boards. The secret, in my opinon, is to hold good honest discussions, attempting to raise the level of the discussion... not necessarily trying to get everyone to think as you do. From what I have seen, so far, on this board... folks seem to enjoy and honor that premise!!! (That's a compliment!!!!)
     
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  8. Pa Jayhawk

    Pa Jayhawk Well-Known Member

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    Agreed!!!

    I have always been a firm believer in giving proper criticism in something where I feel I wasted my money or don't like everything about a product or idea. I will likely do the same if I do not fully understand it fully to draw out discussion, and learn more. I see to many people in general that praise a product to save face simply so they will not feel bad. In the next instant you will see them trying to pawn it on eBay. I would rather not be responsible for someone else buying my mistake because I wanted to save face. In the same sense, you will also likely find a lot of gems out there that were otherwise not apparent for the same reason. What got me into discussion boards on golf was looking for reviews, only to find most of the reviews were just praising products, and talking about the 50 yards gained by a new set of irons. On the forum there is recourse, and you will be forced to stand by that conclusion, and further explain.

    There are even times where I will disagree with parts of what people say even if I am not far off of the same premise just to further draw attention and try and get a better understanding of the product. Heck, a while back we spent about 30-40 pages discussing the science of a device that spins a ball around in a circle. I think in the beginning, alot was based on speculation, I think in the end everyone had a good understanding of the pluses and minuses. I think we all left still split down the middle, but certainly couldn't say we left much information off the table. I likely left feeling a little different than I did going into that, although I am still a creature of habit and didn't get enough contrary information to change my opinion entirely. I believe the same was true for alot of people on here.
     
  9. Golfhound

    Golfhound New Member

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    Golfover, I've been playing golf since the 60's. I even reached the level of mini tour professional. I've played every kind of ball imaginable. There are so many really high quality golf balls on the market. But the MC Lady Precept was the best ball I've ever played. My swing speed at the time of use was around 100 MPH with a driver. But has since decreased to the 80's. So the Lady was perfect, just as soft as a Pro V1, and just as far, for half the price. Once the Lady Precept was discontinued, I tried the Laddie which has a slightly harder surface than the Lady. But it was still responsive to the short game and putting. The Laddie is exactly like the Srixon Hi Spin, another good ball which no longer exists. If you play higher than a 9 handicap, then I would say the Laddie is about the best ball you can buy for the money. It's only when you get down to lower single digits that the ball texture is really going to make a difference. I have about 150 Pro V1's in my closet. I love them, plus the equivalent Bridgestone ball. I use them for competition. The Laddie is my every day ball. A Laddie will last longer than a Pro V1 because of its hard cover and it's a 2 piece ball. If you live up north and play in 40 degree weather, you will need a softer ball than the Laddie. The Laddie will feel like a rock. Precept Laddies are still for sale at WalMart.
     
    Last edited: Oct 4, 2020
  10. azgreg

    azgreg "Don't count that." Supporting Member

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    Holy necro Batman!
     
  11. limpalong

    limpalong Mental Ward Escapee Supporting Member

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    This thread is older than I am!! :>)
     
  12. MCDavis

    MCDavis The Plaid Duffer Staff Member Moderator

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    Was thread even invented when you were born?
     
  13. limpalong

    limpalong Mental Ward Escapee Supporting Member

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    Of course. We needed it to floss the teeth of our pet dinosaurs!!!
     
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