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The Great Gun Debate

Discussion in 'No Golf For You!' started by eclark53520, Sep 25, 2009.

  1. Wi-Golfer

    Wi-Golfer Golfer on hiatus. Supporting Member

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    Let's go back a few years and see how gun control actually worked in Ireland and the UK, anyone recall the IRA? Funny how both countries have strict gun control laws yet the IRA had zero issue with getting whatever they wanted.
    Street corner bombings in London, shootings and rocket attacks in Belfast and then going to come here and tell us how our country should be governed?

    And if guns are so bad why does Switzerland require every household to have at least own?
     
  2. Dogfish Head

    Dogfish Head Well-Known Member TEA is my HERO

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    Eh, the if you don't like it get out nonsense is really annoying. There is a bit of cockiness that some Americans have that doesn't help anything. This countries constitution has been amended many times and some of those amendments repealed. I don't think our founding fathers could have foreseen many of the issues that we face today with the amount of firearms we have in this country.
     
  3. nututhugame

    nututhugame Winter Sucks! Supporting Member

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    Our society is just super violent. The walk around and kill people video games, lyrical content of music that advocates killing anyone who don't like it, all tv and movies, etc, etc, etc... Nobody gives a rat's azz until a tragedy, we just keep plugging along letting our kids be numbed by all forms of influence. My mother in law works at a high school in Racine, WI and she'll tell you quick that it's worse than we think. Parents don't give a feck, they just want the kids out of the house. They will actually get pissed at the school for calling them when their kid beats the $hit out of someone and strikes a teacher when they try to break it up! The kids don't give a feck, the parents don't give a feck, and it doesn't take long before the school has had enough and they don't give a feck. Everyone is psycho on some drug be it street or prescription.

    Guns have nothing to do with that. I will concede that guns make it easier to walk in to anywhere and take out a large # of people really fast. A gun ban will not help that though. I think anywhere on this earth if a guy wants a gun or two it would not be that hard to get them.
     
  4. eclark53520

    eclark53520 DB Member Extraordinaire Supporting Member

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    The lets give up our freedoms nonsense is just as annoying. I refuse to give up freedoms for an empty promise from the government of security. I refuse to allow evil people revoke the rights of millions of good Americans.
     
  5. Dogfish Head

    Dogfish Head Well-Known Member TEA is my HERO

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    So lets repeal the Patriot Act, National Defense Authorization Act, War on Drugs (Freedom to ingest any substance you wish as long as you do not harm others) among many other laws we have that take freedom away from us.

    Lets also create laws that protect the rights of people, such as the right for same sex partners to be offered the same government rights as heterosexual partners.

    I find it ironic that people want to keep guns so that we can "overthrow" a government that oppresses us, yet there is very little effort put into actually making government work for us and to preserve our liberties.

    There are a lot more pressing dangers in this country than your right to own a firearm being taken away. However, that seems to be the one with the most passion associated with it, while the others are just allowed to pass.
     
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  6. BigJim13

    BigJim13 Well-Known Member Staff Member Moderator

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    The difference was that instead of KILLED the children were WOUNDED and now China has handled the situation.
     
  7. Wi-Golfer

    Wi-Golfer Golfer on hiatus. Supporting Member

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    My point about the china attack was to point out that crazies are everywhere and will use weapon they can get their hands on. ban guns and they will use knives, swords, hell a screwdriver or a baseball bat. We will never legislate crazy out of our society and unfortunately acts of violence like this or the one in Norway are the result.
     
  8. BigJim13

    BigJim13 Well-Known Member Staff Member Moderator

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    I used to be pretty liberal on gun ownership. In our last gun debate I didn't have an issue with people that own guns.

    More and more though I am leaning towards banning all handguns and assault type weapons. Hunt? No problem. Shoot trap or clay pigeons? Go for it. No more handguns or assault weapons though, I'm done being ok with it.

    This shooting was a game changer for me. I was middle of the road before, not any more. If our kids aren't safe in school where are they safe?
     
  9. BigJim13

    BigJim13 Well-Known Member Staff Member Moderator

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    I know Wi and I know what you are saying. My pint was that the kids aren't dead.
     
  10. nututhugame

    nututhugame Winter Sucks! Supporting Member

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    I agree with all of this except the gay marraige. States can deal with that mess on their own, the feds have no business getting in that one way or the other.
     
  11. Dogfish Head

    Dogfish Head Well-Known Member TEA is my HERO

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    As long as we remove marriage all together from the federal government and revamp our tax system so that marriage is not a benefit, then ok.
     
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  12. nututhugame

    nututhugame Winter Sucks! Supporting Member

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    I wouldn't be opposed to that since I don't believe there should be an income tax at all. Again, let the states deal with that mess.
     
  13. eclark53520

    eclark53520 DB Member Extraordinaire Supporting Member

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    This will not work. Removing the only way for good people to keep evil people in check is not the right answer to this problem.

    The fact remains that legally owned weapons are not and have never been the problem. Why should I be disarmed, not allowed to protect myself, my wife, my daughter, my family because some guy killed his mother, took her guns and went on a rampage? How do you ever rationalize that? Nobody thinking logically can come to that realization.

    This is all emotion pouring out. Why don't we allow family's to try criminal members in a court of law? Emotions. Its not a good way to handle a situation by reacting emotionally.

    I understand your frustrations. Im sick and tired of this sickness as well, any human being would be. You have to logically realize that banning guns won't stop this. There are too many guns in circulation. Banning weapons is a very slippery slope towards an oppressive government. Again history proves this more than once.
     
  14. BigJim13

    BigJim13 Well-Known Member Staff Member Moderator

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    If this guy didn't have access to a gun those kids would be alive, plain and simple.
     
  15. nututhugame

    nututhugame Winter Sucks! Supporting Member

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    I don't see a gun ban working in any way, shape, or form. What needs work though is morals and family values and things like that. It's like what happens when my kids go to grandma's house... everything I worked for for the last two weeks goes to shit in a one night sleep over. Society has gone to hell in a handbasket in a relatively short span of time. Even if somehow someone grabbed the wheel... it's going to take a long time to right the ship starting from right now. As avid as I have been in defending the right to bear arms, this one hits me hard and makes me think. What can be the solution to these random idiots hauling off and slaughtering scores of innocents for no good reason and then offing themselves so that nobody can even ask them why? How do we combat this? Currently I can't come up with a good answer. It's ridiculous.
     
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  16. eclark53520

    eclark53520 DB Member Extraordinaire Supporting Member

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    I would like to make this suggestion.

    Lets embrace firearms in this country. Lets start teaching kids about guns at a young age. Lets arm teachers. You want to be the person in charge of our children? Prove you can protect them. Lets make guns as every day as pants.

    Lets let every person that thinks they can prey on children at a school, Know that they're going to run into trained professionals with guns in every room of that school.

    Think guns breed violence? Ill bet you everything I own that guns have nothing to do with violence. Lack of respect breeds violence.

    No respect for others, no respect for parents, no respect for life, no respect for society, no respect for guns. Bring respect back to this country and the violence rates will plummet. Get parents to start teaching these kids to respect them, respect themselves, respect everyone.

    I know Im nuts...whatever.
     
  17. eclark53520

    eclark53520 DB Member Extraordinaire Supporting Member

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    Marriage shouldn't ever have been government involved. Its a religious event, should be completely separate from the government.
     
  18. eclark53520

    eclark53520 DB Member Extraordinaire Supporting Member

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    And if he wasn't born this would have happened, and if lots of things happened this wouldn't have happened. Millions of guns out there. Guess who turns in guns after a ban? Guys like you and me. People who will never commit a crime with them. Guess who won't, guys that will. So now they have a target rich environment and now they know nobody is going to fight back.

    Not the type of environment i want to live in.
     
  19. nututhugame

    nututhugame Winter Sucks! Supporting Member

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    Banning guns wouldn't have prevented him from getting guns if he wanted them. Gun bans would only affect law abiding citizens. Going into every household, garage, shed, and digging up yards by force and doing that repeatedly would be the only way to effectively take away guns. And they still wouldn't get them all. Not only would that violate the right to bear arms... it'd violate lots of other rights as well. On top of that it'd trigger a revolution in a heartbeat.
     
  20. eclark53520

    eclark53520 DB Member Extraordinaire Supporting Member

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    With what Im seeing these days, as long as people think the government is going to take care of them, they would give up every right humans have and do it gladly.
    Sad state of affairs and probably why we're having this discussion in the first place.
     

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