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The Great Gun Debate

Discussion in 'No Golf For You!' started by eclark53520, Sep 25, 2009.

  1. Wi-Golfer

    Wi-Golfer Golfer on hiatus. Supporting Member

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    I agree Bob and that's why I said I would never rule anything out, you never know what will happen if enough people get fed up and pissed off enough.
     
  2. BigJim13

    BigJim13 Well-Known Member Staff Member Moderator

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    We may find out what's going to happen to gun ownership in this country, I think enough people are fed up and pissed off now.
     
  3. Wi-Golfer

    Wi-Golfer Golfer on hiatus. Supporting Member

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  4. BigJim13

    BigJim13 Well-Known Member Staff Member Moderator

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    I'm still curious why she had them in one of the safest areas if the country.
     
  5. eclark53520

    eclark53520 DB Member Extraordinaire Supporting Member

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    Why does it matter?
     
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  6. Wi-Golfer

    Wi-Golfer Golfer on hiatus. Supporting Member

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    W
    Why, what difference does it make? I own guns and we live in an area of zero crime, my wife feels better having them because she watches those crime stories on tv where it's always "small town america" where the bad stuff happens.
     
  7. EnglishGolfer

    EnglishGolfer Talks a good game

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    Clearly you didn't bother to read either of the links I provided earlier regarding how Japan and Australia dealt with this issue, probably because it makes your argument weaker if you look at actual facts. You just keep your head buried in the sand while lunatics go on periodic rampages and I'm sure it'll be fine.

    Neither of you has responded to my very simple question, probably because it is difficult to argue against, but IF THERE ARE FEWER GUNS, WOULD THIS NOT MEAN THAT THERE IS LESS GUN CRIME? I await your response (please bear in mind that in my next post be asking you to put a value on the life of a single child)
     
  8. eclark53520

    eclark53520 DB Member Extraordinaire Supporting Member

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    If there were absolutely no guns there would be less gun crime. Until then all you do is disarm law abiding citizens by legislating against guns. If you could promise zero gun crime after a ban i would think about it. You can't.

    There's still the issue of rights and freedom. The life of a child is no more or less valuable than any other life. Using children as emotional leverage doesn't work in logical debate. This is absolutely a tragedy, I feel sick that this happened. Its still not the guns fault.
     
  9. BigJim13

    BigJim13 Well-Known Member Staff Member Moderator

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    It doesn't, that's why I said I was curious. Those are serious guns for your typical woman. Granted I have read next to nothing about her.
     
  10. eclark53520

    eclark53520 DB Member Extraordinaire Supporting Member

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    I guess I could see it that way. or she just had really good taste in defensive weapon systems.

    She should have made sure they weren't accessible though. Especially since her son had known issues.
     
  11. anonymous golfaholic

    anonymous golfaholic Refusing Recovery Supporting Member

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    I agree with you 100%...but I fear the emotional factor in this case will sway lawmakers. This tragedy really crushed the hearts of Americans. My son is in kindergarten and words can't express how I felt when I heard the story. I don't see how this won't weigh heavily in lawmakers decisions...and that scares me.
     
  12. eclark53520

    eclark53520 DB Member Extraordinaire Supporting Member

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    Definitely agree with you.

    Scary for sure. Law makers have been thinking emotionally for a while, and they keep getting voted in. Just promise free stuff, get voted in.
     
  13. nututhugame

    nututhugame Winter Sucks! Supporting Member

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    I would bet that they were in her name, but bought for the son.
     
  14. Wi-Golfer

    Wi-Golfer Golfer on hiatus. Supporting Member

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    And you never responded when I asked if you had ever heard of the Norway killer, hell he killed 3x the people in a country with gun control.

    Don't forget we are the country that did indeed put a price on peoples lives. How many innocent japanese citizens did we kill in Hiroshima and Nagasaki in order to stop more bloodshed and a prolonged war? Freedom has always come at a cost of lives, funny how you a non american will rail against this yet we have untold thousands and thousands of deaths in Iraq and Afghanastan in a war that's needless and has been from the beginning. You want to sign up for a cause how about stopping the bloodshed there? or is not worth your time?
     
  15. nututhugame

    nututhugame Winter Sucks! Supporting Member

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    Whoa whoa whoa.... this is supposed to be an educated debate? I just came here to argue!
     
  16. Wi-Golfer

    Wi-Golfer Golfer on hiatus. Supporting Member

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    Found this little nugget "With the murder rate less than half what it was two decades ago, and violent crime down even more in that time, gun control has declined as a political issue."

    Hmm, guns in more than 1/3rd of the USA households with sales increasing every single month/year and yet the actual murder is less than half.
    Appears to me that what we installed in place currently works fairly well. Like I posted if this mother had been a bit more responsible she wouldn't be dead neither would 27 others. It's not a gun control issue it's a "get your head out of your ass and properly contain your guns" issue.
     
  17. nututhugame

    nututhugame Winter Sucks! Supporting Member

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    Where do I sign up to end our involvment overseas? Bring our loved ones home already. Let the whole middle east implode themselves if that's what they want to do.
     
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  18. Wi-Golfer

    Wi-Golfer Golfer on hiatus. Supporting Member

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    Wish I knew, we have absolutley zero business being over there. Let them have their sand and rocks and kill each other, I don't care.
     
  19. EnglishGolfer

    EnglishGolfer Talks a good game

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    Okay, fair enough. I believe he had some military link and could therefore gain access to a gun. Now if you look at the numbers quoted earlier comparing the dozen or so countries and their homicide rares compared to America, then you'll see that despite this horrific tragedy, all of them added together combine to only a small fraction of the equivalent crime in your country. Making guns illegal doesn't make it impossible to get them, but it means that serious effort has to go into obtaining one, and doing that often brings you to the attention of the authorities.

    Now your turn, will fewer guns means fewer gun crimes?
     
  20. Dogfish Head

    Dogfish Head Well-Known Member TEA is my HERO

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    Wi-Golfer, Norway doesn't have gun crime on the scale of us. Using one example where it has happened doesn't seem quite right when it's our society dealing with mass murders at the hands of guns.

    You are correct in that tougher laws will not remove all the guns and all the crime, but you can clearly see the difference in our society which embraces guns and other societies that do not or at the very least, have much tougher laws on obtaining guns. The numbers are staggering.
     
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