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The LIV (Saudi Tour) Thread

limpalong

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Grumpy Gilmore
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That article makes me dislike Jack Nicklaus even more. He turned the Saudis down sure, but out of loyalty to the PGA Tour, not because the offer was made in blood money.

Also, that article makes me think that if they are really going to boot Norman, it's because they are going to promote Phil to that position. I hope I'm wrong on that, but they sure do allude to it, IMO.
 

IrishGolfer

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I saw a recent interview with McIlroy, who cited the current situation as "toxic". Norman and Michelson are golfing pariahs right now, all their input into the game over the last 20/30 years is now being demeaned. It's a shame that golf is getting to this point. But the players will always chase purses and you can't blame them for that. You can't run a monopoly and expect loyalty. The PGA is showing a nasty side. Time will tell, to see how it pans out. I'm not expecting it to be smooth and I'll sit on the fence to see where it gets to.
 

limpalong

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Also, limp what are you doing linking to that "other" site? 🙄
Saw the headline on Twitter. Didn't even think about who/what the article was on when I posted the link here. Forgive me, Father, for I have sinned. I humbly beg your forgiveness. 😔
 
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Grumpy Gilmore
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I saw a recent interview with McIlroy, who cited the current situation as "toxic". Norman and Michelson are golfing pariahs right now, all their input into the game over the last 20/30 years is now being demeaned. It's a shame that golf is getting to this point. But the players will always chase purses and you can't blame them for that. You can't run a monopoly and expect loyalty. The PGA is showing a nasty side. Time will tell, to see how it pans out. I'm not expecting it to be smooth and I'll sit on the fence to see where it gets to.
But there ARE other tours (European, Asian) so I don't consider the PGA to be a monopoly. And they don't seem to expect loyalty except for the fact that there is the PGA of America (player's union) which if you're part of you'd seem to be locked in. I don't know how it all works but my gripe is that it's the Saudis. Like, what would we be saying if it were the Russian Tour?
 

ualtim

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But there ARE other tours (European, Asian) so I don't consider the PGA to be a monopoly. And they don't seem to expect loyalty except for the fact that there is the PGA of America (player's union) which if you're part of you'd seem to be locked in. I don't know how it all works but my gripe is that it's the Saudis. Like, what would we be saying if it were the Russian Tour?
The other tours (Euro, Asian etc)have a relationship with the PGA Tour. The reason the PGA Tour normally sees the best players in the world on a week to week basis is that it’s purses are typically bigger than the other tours. If a player is disciplined on one Tour, the other Tours will honor that action. The Tours host events with each other where you can earn points on multiple Tours at one event. If there are concurrent tournaments, you can seek and usually get awarded a waiver to play in another Tour’s event.

The LIV Tour is not part of the other Tour’s club. They have the cash and are willing to pay out at higher rates than any of the other Tours. As far as I am aware, no player has been granted a waiver by any of the Tours to play in the first LIV event.

The PGA Tour and the other Tours may not be a true monopoly, but they are sure behaving like one. They are doing their best to prevent competition and threatening their players with expulsion if they play the LIV without a waiver.

I get why some folks are angry with where the money for the LIV Tour is coming from. But to only hold the golfers who choose to play in the LIV Tour events accountable is a bit petty and naive. Why do the courses where the events are to be played and their management/ownership group get free passes for taking the cash? Why are the politicians getting cash from the same source getting free passes? Why do corporations doing business with the same revenue source getting free passes?

To strictly blame pro golfers for chasing the money (and let’s face it, the PGA Tour has bred this into them as they were the highest paying tour traditionally) is placing all of the blame on the wrong folks. Are they part of the problem? Sure, they are contributors to the problem, but they are not the source of the problem. There are folks higher up in the food chain that should be taking more of the blame and wrath.
 
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Grumpy Gilmore
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I get why some folks are angry with where the money for the LIV Tour is coming from. But to only hold the golfers who choose to play in the LIV Tour events accountable is a bit petty and naive. Why do the courses where the events are to be played and their management/ownership group get free passes for taking the cash? Why are the politicians getting cash from the same source getting free passes? Why do corporations doing business with the same revenue source getting free passes?

To strictly blame pro golfers for chasing the money (and let’s face it, the PGA Tour has bred this into them as they were the highest paying tour traditionally) is placing all of the blame on the wrong folks. Are they part of the problem? Sure, they are contributors to the problem, but they are not the source of the problem. There are folks higher up in the food chain that should be taking more of the blame and wrath.
Agree 100%

In fact, I got an email from Pumpkin Ridge asking if I wanted to volunteer when they come to town. I said no because they took the dirty money and raised their members' rates and that's fuked up. All the members (I am not one) are upset about it. The only people I know supporting it are people of the mindset that they get to see professional golf in Portland. To me, it's not even close to being worth it.
 

IrishGolfer

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It's a good debate. Not sure anyone is 100% right but I agree with these points. Only time will tell.
 

ualtim

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UPS dropped its sponsorship of Lee Westwood today for his involvement in the LIV Tour. Played at Southern Hills without the UPS logo today.
 

ualtim

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And UPS also pulled Oosthuizen’s sponsorship for just thinking about playing the LIV.

UPS has drawn a line they will not cross. It will be interesting to see who follows their lead.
 

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