How deep should the rough be?

[ezra76]

I got a taste of it yesterday. I have little problem getting a short iron out of it (just have to account for the flier) but with a longer iron, forget it. I tried to hit a 5iron from nearly 200 and it ripped the face shut on me. I then hit a 6iron steeper and it just shot out like a rocket, fortunately it found a bunker to slow it down. Oddly there are only a few holes where it is really dense and nasty. The left side on the second is the worst, I may just start playing a big fade on that one.

 

[Rockford35]

The left side on the second is the worst, I may just start playing a big fade on that one.

This is exactly what I'm getting at. EXACTLY!

"Geeze, that rough is tough. Maybe I should hit a high fade here or maybe just stroke a 3 wood....I don't wanna be anywhere near that shit."

Is this course management I hear? You mean you need more than just a driver and a wedge?

Say it ain't so, sarge...

R35

PS...Ez, this rant wasn't directed at you, personally....well, maybe a bit.

 

[VtDivot]

But isn't this really the opposite of what the "rough" is? It's not called the "bit tougher fairway". It's called rough because it's rough to get out of.

You can get away with the intermediate rough getting it to the green, but the thick stuff along the tree line should hamper those that are either not straight or bombing with complete disregard to course management.

This "should" be a game of skill and finesse, not just brute strength.

R35

Oh I agree.

I've played some courses that had zero rough - just fairway and wilderness. I hate that.

I like some rough, but not of the break your wrist variety. We had a month of rain here in June and the rough here made the US Open look like Augusta.

 

[Eracer]

Fairways and Gorse. Nothing in-between. You either hit the ball where you want it to go, or you hit another one because your ball is lost.

 

[JEFF4i]

Well I read an interesting article in Golf Magazine or something to the sort, explaining how deep rough doesn't necessarily make sense. Stronger hitters that hit the ball far, should be able to get it out no matter what.

Personally unless it's incredibly wet or incredibly long(6"+), I never have a problem. I simply club up and allow for more roll. Rarely does rough cost me strokes. Shoot at one course it's short enough I take the sacrafice and put it in 5 inch rough, and still can walk away with birdie.

The ones it truly penalizes are people who cannot hit as far and cannot carry the clubhead speed to cut through the rough. So, longer rough may not be better, as you are penalizing those who don't need it, and not really hurting those that do.

 

[Rockford35]

Jeff,

I think the heart of the argument goes to that shorter/weaker hitters are normally straight. I mean, if you're short and crooked, you're me.

Guys that bomb are strong and crooked (usually). So the rough, that they visit so often, would be a good place to start.

I'm willing to bet that Fred Funk could care less if the rough was 2" or 16". He's never there.

R35

 

[bames]

There has to be SOME penalty for missing the fairway - especially with today's forgiving drivers and long balls. I play with a colleague who kills his irons, and I mean KILLS them - he couldn't care less about being in the rough, he just plays "bomb and gouge" all the way around our course. Our rough is really pretty weak. It would be different if it were 6"+, he might have to.. *gasp*..try to hit the fairway. Or worse...manage the course a little! Watching the players while I caddied made this new style of golf all too real. There is a good reason courses are adding length to the holes and the rough.

 

[JEFF4i]

Oh at my home course by all means do you have to manage the course. There are plenty of fairway bunkers and 8 elevated greens.

The rough is constantly at least 5" in length, and the worst part, from the tips no par 4 goes under 430, save one, that is a 80*(Roughly) dogleg left. All of these make it difficult to just whack it and get out there. Tight fairways, some as small as 10 yards in width at point, make decision making harsh. I guess my point is that some places, long rough doesn't make sense if the course is short, but for long ones, even long hitters have to make choices when they know they can be facing 160 from the rough or 185 from the fairway. Fairway please.

 

[bames]

Oh at my home course by all means do you have to manage the course. There are plenty of fairway bunkers and 8 elevated greens.

The rough is constantly at least 5" in length, and the worst part, from the tips no par 4 goes under 430, save one, that is a 80*(Roughly) dogleg left. All of these make it difficult to just whack it and get out there. Tight fairways, some as small as 10 yards in width at point, make decision making harsh. I guess my point is that some places, long rough doesn't make sense if the course is short, but for long ones, even long hitters have to make choices when they know they can be facing 160 from the rough or 185 from the fairway. Fairway please.

Jeff, I agree, we have a short course here that runs through wetlands - no room for error. 6" rough would just be a disaster. Your 5" rough seems plenty challenging, but if it is not long enough (like at my home course, or in the tournament for which I caddied) there is almost no course management required for long bombers. They just whacked it with a driver every time and gouged out with nothing more than an 8 iron.

Long and short rough definitely have their places and are course dependent - I just was amazed at most golfers in the tournement, longer rough would have made it much, much more interesting.

 

[OmegaG5]

I play two courses regularly.

A. has very short "rough", and apart from a few hedges around the boundaries, there's really just no chance of losing a ball. Hit it into the "rough" and there's virtually no penalty. Hit it beyond the "rough" and there's another fairway. The end result is that it is so, so easy to hit the second shot. The holes themselves are easy (despite the stroke indexes). My best round there is 8 over par. But to be honest, it feels like "cheating".

B. has "rough" which is 1.5x to 2x ball height each side of the fairway about 5 yards wide, and then at around 5" outside that, and then the real rough is uncut grass. I still have to break 100 on that course.

So.... Course A is so forgiving, and makes my score look good. (I think that's why other people like to go there too). Course management is a bit of a joke. You can hit a 2nd shot ball from anywhere anyway. Course B is the one that I play four times as often. The holes are much harder generally, the fairways almost all have a slope side to side, there's a lot of elevation changes, and hitting the fairway in the right place is important! Centre of a fairway often means a kick into the rough. Slicing the ball off the tee means real trouble. I love that course. Its the one that gives me the most experience. Its the one I want to conquer as I gain experience.

Some of the posts here make it sound as though some of the guys would like to mow an airfield and play there.
:biglol:

Rod
(I thought it was supposed to be difficult)

 

[ezra76]

This is exactly what I'm getting at. EXACTLY!

"Geeze, that rough is tough. Maybe I should hit a high fade here or maybe just stroke a 3 wood....I don't wanna be anywhere near that shit."

Is this course management I hear? You mean you need more than just a driver and a wedge?

Say it ain't so, sarge...

R35

PS...Ez, this rant wasn't directed at you, personally....well, maybe a bit.

No worries... I wouldn't take anything personal. Yeah, that course has it bad on a few holes, they can't get it growing on a lot of the others so it's mostly a little rough and then hardpan. Hardpan is supereasy to spin it off for me so the only problem there is trying not to ding up a Miura.

That 2nd hole is a monster. Only listed at 425 but I've striped a drive dead center and still had a 6iron in. I honestly think they measured it tee straight to the green but it's a dogleg left.

 

[twogreen]

Many of the holes on my course only have a narrow width of rough bordering each side of the fairway. Some of the fairways slope to the side so severely that a center fairway shot will often roll down into the rough. These are the holes where mowing heighth can be a mixed blessing. If the rough is mowed too closely, the ball can, and often does, roll across the rough into the woodline.

OTOH, if the rough is taller, it will sometimes stop the ball before it enters the woods. In this case you, at least, have a fighting chance for the second shot.

There is no worse feeling than striping a drive almost into the center of the fairway and finding your ball laying amongst the trees for your second shot. Well, actually, there is one worse feeling. One of our holes has a lake bordering one side of the fairway instead of woods.